[meteorite-list] Ad 32 Auctions Lots of Good Deals!

From: Adam Hupe <raremeteorites_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2018 16:19:14 -0800
Message-ID: <067da864-a549-b62f-92e1-256d93ddda12_at_centurylink.net>

John, This string has been changed to BLM Public land. We can also go
back to the infamous D.G. Schmitt papers which stated the following and
started much of the this grief back in 2001.

"United States of America. A find is owned by the land-owner. A
find on federal government property is owned by the Department
of the Interior but may be acquired by the Smithsonian
Institution."

https://www.lpi.usra.edu/meetings/metsoc2001/pdf/5150.pdf

or where meteorites were deemed cultural objects that should not be
squandered on dealers and collectors:

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1945-5100.2002.tb00897.x/pdf


Adam


On 1/8/2018 3:58 PM, John Lutzon via Meteorite-list wrote:
> I tried--I really did....but
> All pertinent information has been conveyed and understood by All.
> Everything else,in my opinion, is bloviated non-information.
> Someone needs to let this thread go--geeee,--I wonder who that
> may be?
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Adam Hupe via Meteorite-list" <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> To: "metlist" <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> Sent: Monday, January 08, 2018 6:36 PM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad 32 Auctions Lots of Good Deals!
>
>
> Micheal, You are breaking your own proposed rule by posting to the List.
> I think meteorite hunters have a right to know the issues that could
> have an affect on hunting meteorites on public land.
>
> I tried to change the subject heading but people keep posting to this
> string.
>
> Adam
>
>
>
> On 1/8/2018 3:30 PM, Michael Mulgrew via Meteorite-list wrote:
>> Then send him a private note, and respond to his note to you in private.
>>
>> I would argue that you going on and on and on about this draws more
>> attention to it than the ad itself.
>>
>> Michael in so. Cal.
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 8, 2018 at 3:08 PM, Adam Hupe via Meteorite-list
>> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com> wrote:
>>> Larry,
>>>
>>> I do not have a problem with you personally. I enjoy your field reports but
>>> was dismayed to see meteorites found on public land being offered up on a
>>> commercial basis since it could have an affect on the future of meteorite
>>> hunting. I have been involved with BLM land discussions since the 1990's so
>>> this is nothing new.
>>>
>>> These laws are being enforced which I am sure people will hear about at the
>>> Tucson show. No, I am not the snitch. Actually there are several. If the
>>> name of just one these snitches (informants) got out, it would shock the
>>> entire community. It only takes one person, with their hand caught in the
>>> cookie jar, to try and save their own butt by turning on others.
>>>
>>> My negativity stems from all the damage that has occurred to this avocation,
>>> being ripped off and badmouthed by dealers. I have no problem with
>>> collectors who I tend to side with these days. Every argument I have had
>>> has been with dealers, mainly the 3.0 crowd.
>>>
>>>
>>> Adam
>>>
>>>
>>> On 1/8/2018 2:45 PM, Larry Atkins wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Adam,
>>>>
>>>> Man, you are killing me. Are you just bored? Why are you singling out me
>>>> and my auctions? I've never done anything to you, and don't say you are just
>>>> trying to protect me and other dealers, you are drawing undo attention,
>>>> that's not protection. Leave sleeping dogs lie. I can't believe that after
>>>> the last few years of watching you drag people into ridiculousville you've
>>>> finally got me. On one hand I really want to ignore you but I can't.
>>>>
>>>> I sell once a year, enough to cover a tiny percentage of the costs of the
>>>> pursuit. I contribute valuable information and new meteorites to science as
>>>> often as I can, all with my own hard earned money. I started my poison ivy
>>>> control business 12 years ago just so that I could pursue meteorites and
>>>> contribute to the science. I spent thousands of my own dollars to open up
>>>> and document the Nevada side of Gold Basin, (which is now confirmed by Dr.
>>>> Kring and publication is pending.) How much sweat and treasure do you think
>>>> Osceola cost me? How about weeks and weeks on end for two winters in your
>>>> back yard, unraveling the Bullhead City strewn field all on my dime? I've
>>>> worked very hard over the years in my spare time to be a positive force in
>>>> this hobby, sharing with whom ever and wherever I can.And yes, I'm defensive
>>>> right now because I take your posts personally. I feel like you are trying
>>>> to draw attention to me, specifically, right now while my once or so a year
>>>> ebay ads are running, and I don't deserve that You should pick someone else
>>>> to target, maybe someone that is actually out doing bad things.
>>>>
>>>> While I'm at it, if this was something that actually needed to be
>>>> adhered to, everyone that has ever bought a questionable meteorite should
>>>> throw it in the garbage right now. Universities and institutions that have
>>>> procured these same falls and finds should throw theirs on the burn pile
>>>> too, or turn themselves in and be prosecuted for trafficking. So as anyone
>>>> of sound mind can see, that's ridiculous and these laws are very much not
>>>> unlike other b.s. laws of the past and present, practically unenforceable
>>>> and wrong to begin with. A crime needs a victim by definition and I don't
>>>> see a victim here. Furthermore, the stones would have to be reclassified and
>>>> proven to be legitimate, then in the case of say Battle Mountain, Gold
>>>> Basin, Franconia or Indian Butte, to name a few, there is a checkerboard or
>>>> mix of private / public land. Which stone is this? Where was this particular
>>>> stone found? Prove where the stone came from! And all for what? What a joke,
>>>> a complete waste of resources. It's like trying to enforce sodomy laws or
>>>> tell people they can't smoke weed, forget it. My neighbor in Az is a county
>>>> sheriff and I watch him do a rolling stop everyday at the stop sign in front
>>>> of the house, do I lecture him? Should I call his boss? GET REAL. These laws
>>>> you cite are wrong headed, or at the very least, if used to prosecute a guy
>>>> like me, that would not be in the true spirit of which they were written.
>>>> Despite the fact you say you don't agree with the laws, you seem to be quite
>>>> an outspoken proponent on this list, unless of course it interferes with
>>>> your pursuits.
>>>>
>>>> Adam, I used to have great respect for you, and though I can't take away
>>>> anything positive you've done in the past, it would seem your days of
>>>> positive contribution are over. During the past several years your posts
>>>> have continually deteriorated in such a negative way that I don't respect
>>>> you anymore. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if you are the snitch you
>>>> mention. You're not my meteorite Daddy and I didn't ask for your advice or
>>>> your protection. Please do not comment on my posts in the future. Like I
>>>> said to you once in the past, relax man, get outside and go find a
>>>> meteorite. Find something constructive to do. Based on the emails, texts
>>>> and phone calls I've received today, many others would agree.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sincerely,
>>>> Larry
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Adam Hupe via Meteorite-list <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>>>> To: metlist <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>>>> Sent: Mon, Jan 8, 2018 12:21 pm
>>>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ad 32 Auctions Lots of Good Deals!
>>>>
>>>> What happens if meteorites are collected illegally from public lands? If
>>>> meteorites are collected illegally from public lands you can be cited under
>>>> FLPMA and the regulations at 43 CFR 8365.1-5(a) for illegal removal of any
>>>> personal property or any scientific resource or natural object. You will
>>>> also be subject to criminal prosecution under title 18, section 641 for the
>>>> theft of Federal property and related criminal statutes depending on the
>>>> type of illegal activity, including false labeling under title 18, section
>>>> 1001. I would take this very seriously. There are snitches in our midst as
>>>> many have found out the hard way. On 1/7/2018 11:54 AM, Larry Atkins via
>>>> Meteorite-list wrote: > Thanks for the heads up, but really... > > Sent from
>>>> AOL Mobile Mail > > > >
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >
>>>> On Sunday, January 7, 2018 Adam Hupe via Meteorite-list >
>>>> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com <mailto:list at meteoritecentral.com>>
>>>> wrote: > > I do not normally comment on ads but sellers should keep in mind
>>>> that > selling meteorites found on public lands in the U.S. is against
>>>> federal > law. I do not want to see anybody get into trouble because, as
>>>> some List > Members have found out the hard way, the BLM does monitor
>>>> meteorite > sales, especially eBay. Meteorites may be casually collected,
>>>> i.e., for > free and without a permit, under FLPMA However,in accordance
>>>> with the > BLM's regulations at 43 CFR 8365.1-5 collection is limited to
>>>> certain > public lands, (2) only specimens up to ten pounds may be collected
>>>> per > person per year, and (3) only surface collection with the use of >
>>>> non-motorized and non-Mechanical equipment is allowed; metal detectors > are
>>>> okay. However, specimens that are casually collected are for > personal use
>>>> only, and may not be bartered or sold for commercial > purposes. Reference:
>>>>> https://www.blm.gov/sites/blm.gov/files/uploads/IM2012-182_att1.pdf >
>>>> Happy hunting, > On 1/7/2018 8:56 AM, Larry Atkins via Meteorite-list wrote:
>>>>>> List, > > > I have 32 auctions running right now with some ending in
>>>> about 24 > hours. Most started at .99 with no reserve and some still have no
>>>> bids. > There are a few items rarely offered, like Osceola, the witnessed
>>>> fall > from Florida. Or NWA 11107 a rare eucrite melt. Right now there is a
>>>> 2.8 > gram end cut with only 2 bids, $2.51 at the moment. > > Some other >
>>>> highlights would be the rarely offered Arizona find officially > recognized
>>>> as Bullhead City. Another rarely offered Arizona meteorite, > the witnessed
>>>> fall called Indian Butte, aka Stanfield. I have a low TKW > Howardite that
>>>> is gorgeous, NWA 11184. It's a 2.71 gram full slice that > is currently at
>>>> $13.00. > > Don't miss the extraordinary Anda tektites. > The first 2 I put
>>>> up sold quick, there are 2 more up with very > reasonable buy it now prices
>>>> and a quick search on the internet will > demonstrate the rarity, these
>>>> things are practically unobtainable. > > > Others listed are: > Holbrook
>>>> frag's from my big find in 2007. > A 3.2 > kg Gold Basin from the Nevada
>>>> side. > NWA 6581 an LL6. > NWA 10140 Lunar > 1 of only 2 anorthositic
>>>> troctolite. > unclassified NWA type3 slices. > > NWA 8663 A complete crusted
>>>> eucrite stone with no bids and no reserve! > > > There are others as well,
>>>> take a minute and check them out if > interested. > > Thank you. > > > > >
>>>> https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=&_in_kw=1&_ex_kw=&_sacat=0&_udlo=&_udhi=&_ftrt=901&_ftrv=1&_sabdlo=&_sabdhi=&_samilow=&_samihi=&_sadis=15&_stpos=48438-9655&_sargn=-1%26saslc%3D1&_salic=1&_fss=1&_fsradio=%26LH_SpecificSeller%3D1&_saslop=1&_sasl=alienrockfarm&_sop=12&_dmd=1&_ipg=200
>>>>>>>> Sincerely, > Larry Atkins > > > > >
>>>> www.CosmicConnectionMeteorites.com
>>>> <http://www.CosmicConnectionMeteorites.com> >
>>>> <http://www.CosmicConnectionMeteorites.com> > IMCA # 1941 > > > Ebay
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Received on Mon 08 Jan 2018 07:19:14 PM PST