[meteorite-list] Another warning re sales to Italy

From: Michael Blood <mlblood_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 26 Jul 2016 16:33:05 -0700
Message-ID: <D3BD4141.4A26B%mlblood_at_cox.net>

Hi Joachim,

        You did not hear what I said. I said only that there were
Innumerable reports re the unreliability of the postal service
In Italy and there was a notorious person there that has many
Times ripped off dealers in the US and who constantly changes
His name and email address to effect such rip offs, avoid being
Ousted from the meteorite list, etc. - and that the individual I
Dealt with I would never deal with again. (Dean Bessey reported
He had a disastrous experience with this same individual).

        Just because I will never sell to Italy again in no way means
I think Italians are some group of untrustworthy individuals. It is
Only two turkeys and a dysfunctional postal system that guides my
Actions. Not some pitiful bigoted attitude!

        Remember, I live in a country where, God help us, a notorious
Scam artist fascist with an outrageous narcissistic personality disorder
Is liable to be seen as representative of our people!

        Best regards, Michael


On 7/26/16 3:05 AM, "Meteorite List" <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Italy has more than 60 Million people. Most are honest and kind. Maybe
> you have problems getting money via a lawywer and a court but it is
> the same when I sell something to the US ( or Japan or to the moon )
> To say not to sell something to italy is if I would say all New
> Yorkers or Inhabitants of california are gangsters. Just check every
> person, mail or phone but please do not generalize in such a way.
>
> Greetings from Germany ( where are also nice people, thick ones, thin
> ones, idiots, intelligent people and all other kind of humang beings. )
>
>
> Joachim
> Zitat von Michael Blood via Meteorite-list
> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>:
>
>> Hi Doug,
>> I am glad to hear your dealings with this individual have been
>> Positive. I cannot say the same. However, after denying he refused
>> To pay the shipment (this sounds like a refusal to me:
>>
>> " So I must pay 110$ for shipment... More other 150 or more for Italian
>> custom with fedex..
>> No is impossible pay so much for Henbury.
>> Sorry
>> Davide" )
>>
>> he finally did send me almost all the remainder of the shipping
>> cost.
>> I still will never sell anything to anyone in Italy again due to all
>> the reports on their postal system and on individuals, including this
>> One (see Bessey post).
>> Again, happy your dealings have been more positive.
>> Michael
>>
>> On 7/24/16 4:28 PM, "MexicoDoug" <mexicodoug at aol.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Captain B,
>>>
>>> As we say, "A bad negotiation is better than a good fight."
>>>
>>> 99% your customer is not the one you thought. That suspicion is
>>> hurting you.
>>> You can Google the customer and find out one by his name has done a
>>> couple of
>>> exhibitions for Emilia-Romagna, lectures and belongs to a local astronomical
>>> society, gives advice on meteorites even including one case where
>>> there was a
>>> shipping question in which his reply was to work with the Seller to resolve
>>> it. Try one more time, maybe a show of goodwill above and beyond what is
>>> required offer to split the $60, and do it face to face by calling
>>> dado_sanna
>>> on Skype ...
>>>
>>> Next time just collect shipping costs up front ... rather than exposing
>>> yourself. I feel for your customer's situation, having been in a
>>> similar one
>>> for many years because of the unfortunate state of the local postal service
>>> and the rampant corruption and pilfering throughout the system. I hope you
>>> will reconsider supporting our enthusiastic Italian (Brasilian, Russian and
>>> Mexican) friends so as to do a part in giving them access to reputable
>>> meteorite sellers.
>>>
>>> Although your customer's expectations were misplaced, it is still a case of
>>> misunderstanding that could have been prevented - even if that
>>> meant two trips
>>> to FedEx if it was too difficult to calculate the shipping cost yourself.
>>>
>>> In the case of Italy, ask if they can cough up a shipping address to a
>>> different EU nation to initially receive the shipment and from
>>> where they can
>>> be responsible to reship to the Italian address. The situation is far less
>>> problematic if the parcel arriving in Italy originates in the current
>>> Eurozone, vs. the US and Canada which at this moment happen to be
>>> outside the
>>> walls surrounding Byzantium. It will likely get their much faster
>>> too, so it
>>> can benefit them.
>>>
>>> While this may not make sense to many people who take for granted less
>>> problematical postal services, or don't care about the little saintly
>>> collector, speaking from personal experience and cravings,
>>> sometimes there are
>>> specimens that are "must have" and being told "NO! I don't ship to
>>> X" can be
>>> a huge depressant.
>>>
>>> If the collector is conscientious about their situation, they can
>>> just adjust
>>> their purchases accordingly and save up for the moments that are truly
>>> special, and better yet, get a helping hand from other sympathetic European
>>> collectors. I responded to this thread because too often I had the
>>> "We don't
>>> ship to X", door slammed in my face. It never happened with meteorites but
>>> was a problem with larger companies. You did a nice thing, btw, and I don't
>>> think you will end up burnt in the end since the collector had a
>>> misunderstanding and I am sure he will want to correct it in a positive
>>> manner.
>>>
>>> As for Italy, firm cash up front, insurance (U-pic or InsurePost), and check
>>> registered FC mail rules on commercial sales to see what's permitted and
>>> what's not ...
>>>
>>> Kindest wishes
>>> Doug
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Michael Blood <mlblood at cox.net>
>>> To: MexicoDoug <mexicodoug at aol.com>; Meteorite List
>>> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>>> Sent: Sun, Jul 24, 2016 2:31 am
>>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Another warning re sales to Italy
>>>
>>> Hi Doug,
>>> Thanks for the kind words. However, I have saved all
>>> The emails and believe me, there was absolutely no confusion
>>> Re shipping - -clarified clearly (twice) that if Fed EX were
>>> less than $50 I would refund him the difference and if it
>>> were more than $50 he would have to agree to paypal me
>>> the difference.
>>> He stated I should not have put the "real value" on the shipment -
>>> AFTER I had sent it - When Fed Ex turned out to be more, then
>>> He complained he would have to pay the import fee and wouldn't
>>> Pay any more for the shipping.
>>> Kind and gentle is always best and I tried that for several
>>> Posts to no avail whatever.
>>> No, this is a clear cut case of being ripped off. I suspect it is
>>> Our old "friend" as his approach is nearly identical and his English
>>> Is similarly distorted. But whether it is or not the results are identical.
>>> I, too, like to think people are basically honest and live up to
>>> Their commitments and I do deal with people that way and the vast
>>> Majority of people in the meteorite community are that way.
>>> Also, I do not believe for a second this is "typical of Italians" -
>>> only two - and possibly only one - have/has acted this way. Every
>>> Country has both the saintly and the cur.
>>> Good to hear from you, Doug,
>>> Michael
>>>
>>> On 7/23/16 10:32 PM, "MexicoDoug" <mexicodoug at aol.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Michael,
>>>>
>>>> How discouraging, as if doing what you love wasn't already a labor of love.
>>>> Your customer appears to be a dedicated collector, exhibitor, lecturer, and
>>>> dealer (involved with meteorites and as using them as raw materials for
>>>> selling trinkets and watch dials, including to school children). You could
>>>> double-check if it is not a miscommunication from your message exchange
>>>> defining who was supposed to pay for what. The immediate problem was not
>>>> Italy, as much as the expensive, secure shipping cost which you understood
>>>> was
>>>> to be paid by him as it sounds like he received the meteorite and
>>>> you have a
>>>> tracking receipt.
>>>>
>>>> Or, next time you are in Rimini, stop by this hair salon and go collect if
>>>> the
>>>> friendly approach doesn't pan out. Maybe settle for a seafood
>>>> risotto. I'd
>>>> make an appointment first and bring a bottle of wine _at_ (+39)3485447938. He
>>>> really doesn't seem like a scammer!
>>>>
>>>> Kindest wishes
>>>> Doug
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Michael Farmer via Meteorite-list
>>>> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>>>> To: Michael Blood <mlblood at cox.net>; Meteorite Mailing List
>>>> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>>>> Sent: Sat, Jul 23, 2016 9:37 pm
>>>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Another warning re sales to Italy
>>>>
>>>> Why do people ignore warnings? Italy is notorious for
>>>> scams and stolen packages.
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>> On Jul 23, 2016, at 6:36 PM, Michael Blood via Meteorite-list
>>>>> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>> You all may recall that several years ago multiple
>>>>> Dealers warned against sales to Italy. It seams at
>>>>> Least one buyer was claiming not to have received
>>>>> Shipments that were verified, not to have received
>>>>> Money that was sent him, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> Unfortunately, I failed to head warnings about
>>>>> Shipping to Italy. A different Italian contacted me (Or
>>>>> At least one using a different name and email) and
>>>>> I explained even Registered Mail seems to fail to
>>>>> guarantee delivery in Italy but I somehow allowed
>>>>> him to talk me into a Fed Ex shipment of a specimen.
>>>>> I agreed, providing he send $50 shipping and agree
>>>>> to pay any additional amount Fed Ex might charge.
>>>>>
>>>>> Perhaps it is the same fellow from several years ago
>>>>> Using a different name (he was so good at that Art could
>>>>> Not keep him off the list because he would just join again
>>>>> Using a different name and email). So, beware of:
>>>>>
>>>>> "Davide Urbinati" <urbinati.davide at gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Even though I scanned the receipt and sent it to him
>>>>> He refused to pay the $59.79 Fed Ex charged me. So, I am
>>>>> Out that $.
>>>>>
>>>>> Believe me, I will never ship to Italy again.
>>>>>
>>>>> Better luck to all of you,
>>>>> Michael Blood
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>
>>
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Received on Tue 26 Jul 2016 07:33:05 PM PDT