[meteorite-list] Retail & Auction Price Guides
From: mail at mhmeteorites.com <mail_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2011 14:32:12 +0000 Message-ID: <1261006556-1298644330-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-770415143-_at_bda686.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Hi Richard Seems we just completely disagree. I won't reiterate my points again, but we have survived in this hobby for several decades since the first large dealers began without a price guide and survived quite well. If there is a place for a guide then why hasn't one stuck over that time period? There have been several attempts before Kevin, with no success. Again the collecting market can determine the need for a guide. Why not do your own pricing? Kevin admits he doesn't use auctions ad doesn't know what the dealers SOLD items for. To me a guide like that is not useful. REALIZED prices may be ok, but good luck getting those data from dealers. Matt ------------------------ Matt Morgan Mile High Meteorites http://www.mhmeteorites.com P.O. Box 151293 Lakewood, CO 80215 -----Original Message----- From: Richard Kowalski <damoclid at yahoo.com> Sender: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2011 23:20:02 To: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com> Subject: [meteorite-list] Retail & Auction Price Guides Sorry for making another subject change on this Kevin & Matt. I have to argue directly against you one this one Matt. Retail price guides and auction results have a very real and useful place in any collectibles market, especially for a market as small and thin as the meteorite market. While I do not have Kevin's price guide, I certainly think it is something useful. Auction results are a very important tool too. Nearly everyone on this list who spoke up not too long ago when asked about interests other than meteorites said they collect some thing or other. Many of these collectors collected coins and notes, numisma. Since this is the first collecting bug tat bit me too, I'll discuss this market in those terms. Coins, tokens, notes, etc is a huge market, but value is assigned by the numerous points already raised and more, but are always dictated by supply and demand. Many relatively common coins are very valuable because so many collectors desire them while vast areas of numismatics, which are rather esoteric, may only have a few hundred of even just one or a few collectors worldwide. That is a type of market the we find ourselves in. I've had a number of you with customer lists privately estimate for me the worldwide number of active meteorite collectors and the consensus seems to be well under 1000. Many estimate the number to be around 500. Double or maybe triple that and you have the total number of active and sporadic collectors. Adam Hupe often points out how rare meteorites are and that is very true. The flip side of that is the meteorite collector base is minuscule. Just in those small areas of numismatics many insanely rare, beautiful and interesting items go for pennies. The money collector community and market is literally thousands of years old and has a huge worldwide collector base. There are price guides to be found that include highly esoteric topics with no concern about new collectors being confused by retail versus wholesale. The pricing methodology is outlined and the collector is urged to learn as much as they can about the material and pricing. Same as meteorites no? When I started seriously collecting meteorites a few years ago, I already had some information about meteorites and vast experience as a collector, so the first order of things for me was 1, determine which direction I wanted my collecting to go. 2, determine which dealers were trustworthy and 3, how much do I pay? 1 & 2 were easy but #3 was more difficult. I wish I knew of Kevin's guide back then. It would have saved me some time and effort. For me I'd like to see a few more guides, not less. I bet Michael could turn a very nice profit if he sold PDF books of all the auction lots and prices realized from this year and at all of his previous auctions too. I know I'd buy a copy. Cheers -- Richard Kowalski Full Moon Photography IMCA #1081 --- On Thu, 2/24/11, mail at mhmeteorites.com <mail at mhmeteorites.com> wrote: > From: mail at mhmeteorites.com <mail at mhmeteorites.com> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tucson Auction #1 > To: "Kevin Kichinka" <marsrox at gmail.com>, meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > Date: Thursday, February 24, 2011, 8:01 PM > Hi Kevin and list: > Kevin, while I appreciate what you are doing and applaud > you for putting together a detailed and extensive list, I > will just say that I think any price guides in any field are > problematic.? All collectibles are worth only what one > is willing to pay.? Coinage may be a different > situation since there is underlying value in the metal > commodity and there are fairly accurate mintage numbers. > > A good example are home values.? An owner can ask 500k > for their home but only realize 300k in today's > "market".? Zillow.com is a great example of how a > "price guide" should work; they show the recently sold price > not asking prices (as you do in your guide).? If one > were to use asking prices the housing market would be > artificially higher than what is realized in the market. > > I also think that price guides give collectors a false > sense of hope when it comes to selling their > collections.? For example, a dealer should be paying > them $10/g for Estherville (according to a price from your > list) when in fact I wouldn't pay more than $6/g, which is > perceived as "ripping" the collector off. This creates a > feeling of animosity for the collector and may result in > them not collecting any longer. > > With meteorites or any other collectible for that matter, a > dealer (or any person with the item) can ask whatever he or > she wishes to ask.? The consumer is best served by > doing their own market analysis. As you pointed out there > are dozens of different reasons for assigning a value to a > meteorite, many of which are subjective (appearance, > freshness, orientation, etc.). Even the TKW is misleading if > one uses the MetBull as the standard for that.? Who > says that Allende is "worth" 10/g? The consumer does. Not > Kevin, not Matt, not Cap"n Blood. > > So while price guides may seem like a good idea and may be > perceived as educational, I think they offer little to no > value in the collectible marketplace.? I could go on, > but my fingers are tired from the Blackberry keyboard! > > Matt > > ------------------------ > Matt Morgan > Mile High Meteorites > http://www.mhmeteorites.com > P.O. Box 151293 > Lakewood, CO 80215 ______________________________________________ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-listReceived on Fri 25 Feb 2011 09:32:12 AM PST |
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