[meteorite-list] Meteorite Pricing/Values

From: dean bessey <deanbessey_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Fri Dec 23 22:01:42 2005
Message-ID: <20051224030140.4081.qmail_at_web31514.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hi. I think that I may have mis-wrote my comment about
michael Blood in my earlier email. My apologies about
that. A couple mixed up words on a long email that I
never properly checked for grammar and the whole
meaning changes.
But my comments about auctions is generally true. I
have had people wanting me to sell Bensour for $2 a
gram after a couple small 3 or 4 gram pieces went for
that price on ebay and they tried to argue that it was
the going rate now (Personally I believe that Bensour
is probabloy the most undervalued meteorite out there
- the low price partly the result of a tiff between a
couple bickering dealers just after it fell that made
the innitial price less than it should have been).
At Michael Bloods past auctions I have always been a
multi lot buyer and had a smile a mile wide after the
prices I got things at. Well below what I knew dealers
at the show was successfully selling things at. So to
quote Michael Blood again:
"I am often told by dealers they resent my auction
because the next day someone will come in and ask
about a specific meteorite, saying, "It sold for
XX/gram at the auction last night!"
implying they "should" be able to get it at a similar
price".
This does indeed happen but dealers generally dont get
swayed by it as they know what the real price they can
get is. And there is limits to the amount that could
have been acquired at the auction price anyway (Or as
blood correctly pointed out - at least one increment
higher).
Of course at bloods auction I have an advantage over
collectors when buying. Collectors go to tucson
looking for specific meteorites or want things
different from what is in their collections already.
Me, on the other hand, will buy anything that is going
for less than it is worth since I know that I can get
fair value later - and also I dont have a limited
budget shutting me down because it is a business buy
and not something that I have to pay for out of my
income and can use my line of credit if I run out of
money. Most buyers in tucson have a semi-firm budget
and cant buy everything they want even if they would
be willing to pay that price.
But auctions (Especially Bloods auction because it is
such a nice social gathering also) is a fun way to
acquire something - wither the price is higher or
lower than from dealers.
As far as me going to Tucson, it dont look like I will
although its not completely out yet. My wife will be 7
months pregnant then so she cant travel anyway and she
still dont have her New Zealand passport (Due to
spending to much time in canada last year) so will be
hard for her to get an american visa anyway.
Bloods auction is one of the biggest things that I
miss when I skip tucson - especially since I am pretty
confident that I can pay for the trip from buys at the
auction. The auction makes Tucson even more attractive
than it already is and obviously should not be missed
by anybody there. I think it is set up for the middle
weekend when most meteorite people is going to be in
Tucson so it is convenient timing.
So have a good time - just dont ask me to match prices
that you see at the auction afterwards in my sales
Cheers
DEAN




--- Michael L Blood <mlblood_at_cox.net> wrote:

> on 12/23/05 4:11 PM, Thomas Uza at
> biscuit_40_at_yahoo.com wrote:
> > Value is an emotional or instictive response based
> on
> > priorities.
> > Thomas
> -----------------
> Hi Thomas,
> That is exactly right - and I was astonished
> to hear my friend,
> Dean misquote me as saying otherwise! I have ALWAYS
> held the
> stance you express above - especially when it comes
> to auction
> prices. Auctions have the additional pressure of
> each person having
> a finite amount of $ relative to the number of items
> s/he might
> find highly desirable.
> When I started putting together my catalog,
> I started going, "Man,
> I am going to have to bid on THIS one, myself! .....
> over and over and
> over, until I realized there was no way I could get
> all these, even if they
> sold way below my cut off price - because there are
> many. many more
> of them than there are dollars in my pocket.
> Therefore, a meteorite auction would only
> reflect the "true value"
> of meteorites offered if two impossible criteria
> were met:
> 1) every meteorite collector in the world were
> present
> 2) all bidders had AS LONG AS THEY WANTED/NEEDED to
> pay off their bids.
> Of course, both these criteria are very much
> NOT in play. Instead,
> we have a very finite number of bidders (no matter
> how many come)
> AND they must pay off in full immediately. That
> severely "bends" any
> possible "reflection" of "market value" on each and
> every sale.
> I am often told by dealers they resent my
> auction because the next
> day someone will come in and ask about a specific
> meteorite, saying,
> "It sold for XX/gram at the auction last night!"
> implying they "should"
> be able to get it at a similar price.
> There is only one answer to such a
> fool....... "If you wanted it at
> that price you should have bought it at the
> auction!" Of course, they
> would NOT have gotten it at that price - even at the
> auction, as they
> would have had to go AT LEAST one bidding increment
> HIGHER than
> what it sold for - and there is nothing to guarantee
> that bid wouldn't
> have been taken yet higher.
> So, when collectors walk around Tucson
> "armed" with the information
> of what price something sold for at the auction, you
> are, in fact, unarmed!
> In addition, if there happen to be several
> collectors who want
> a specific piece it can go for far more than it
> might otherwise go for.
> This is what makes auctions such a hoot. It is
> because they NEVER reflect
> the "true market value" of items that they are so
> exciting and fun - both
> for buyers and for sellers. And I have never heard
> of someone going into
> a room the day after the auction and saying, "Man, I
> can't take advantage
> of you this way. That stuff sold for $5/g more at
> auction last night -
> here, take more money!"
> Sellers, especially when entering items with
> no minimum, are
> assuring themselves of a considerable amount of
> income..... some high,
> some low, but averaging out to a lot of money,
> regardless, AND they are
> not "setting the market" at a lower level while
> assuring themselves of
> a big hunk of change coming in.
> Buyers get two things:
> 1) a huge variety of highly desirable specimens
> 2) most at "no minimum" meaning EVERYONE has a shot
> at it.
> (last year a full slice of LA 002 - unavailable at
> ANY price, went
> for well below the price it's sister, LA 001 sells
> for regularly. I
> KICKED MYSELF OVER AND OVER FOR MONTHS that I did
> not
> bid on that piece well above what it sold for! -
> fortunately, the
> person who DID get it is a terrific guy, so, I feel
> less freaked out
> about not getting it myself).
> I wish Dean would bring his beautiful bride
> to the Tucson
> Show for us all to see here and admire his South
> Pacific tan. But,
> alas, he is apparently having too much fun on the
> other side of the
> globe.
> So, the point is.... Dean is right that he
> and I are good friends,
> but very much wrong in saying I said auctions
> indicate squat about
> meteorite market values!
> Best wishes and a MERRY CHRISTMAS to all!
> Michael
>
>
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>
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Received on Fri 23 Dec 2005 10:01:40 PM PST


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