[meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup?

From: Greg Hupé <gmhupe_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 13:21:18 -0400
Message-ID: <1AF93A65E57C4711A69E3FE6B2EC9186_at_Gregor>

I always love early morning hikes through the desert looking for my beloved
Beanie Babies, such a fulfilling hobby! I never attempt to capture them or
molest them in any way, photos only using a 600mm zoom lens as to not
interfere with their morning feeding activities. They are extremely rare out
of captivity so when ever I spot one in the wild it is most gratifying!!

I believe I am going to change my career and hobby path in life. I have
thought about this over the last few weeks and decided that I will apply to
be a BLM officer and approach my new bosses about being the point officer in
charge of identifying suspect meteorites found by the casual hunter,
scientists and the rare professional desert hunter/dealer. Said 'meteorites'
would have to come to me in my cushy air conditioned office and it would be
at my sole discretion to decide if a particular rock is a meteorite or not.
As part of my negotiated pay working for the BLM, I would of course have
been authorized a FREE life-time casual/scientific/commercial permit in
order to take these bogus stones from 'the vacationist' and line my person
garden with them. On my days off I would go hunt for meteorites and maybe
'get lucky' every now and then. With my special new "Casual
Collector/Scientific/Commercial" badge, I could hunt to my hearts desire and
do with any finds as I wish. But remember, this is because I negotiated for
this shiny special badge as part of my monthly paycheck so it would be like
buying said permit(s) anyway!!

Hope everyone has a fabulous day, and be sure to Rock On!! :)

Best Regards,
Greg


-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Wooddell
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 10:29 AM
To: Meteorite List
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New BLM regs: Tempest in a teacup?

Hi Norm and all!

Here is some clarification info and such....

I do not know anyone who has gone through the permit process to obtain
a permit the priviledge of hunting meteorites on BLM land. Not sure
it has ever been required or any have ever been issued. I do not know
a current dealer / hunter that has permits to hunt meteorites on BLM
land. Can you share some examples?


I am not a lawyer and can not offer anything but my own opinion based
on information I have gathered communicating with various BLM
representatives, both local and national level. I am not trying to
share BS here, only sharing information. These new rules do not
affect me as an amateur Meteorite hunter. They do effect me as an
amateur researcher for science.

I believe the BLM's new rules on meteorites do clarify much of what
the meteorite hunting community knew. The question on the use of
metal detectors for example, was in question by many. This issue is
now clarified in favor of all hunters. However, I want to point out
that local policy for any specific area could be different based on
the local Land Use Plan, which I think is the ultimate policy for a
given area.

They have defined meteorite hunters and operation into three users of the
land.

The first type of user is the "casual" or hobby collector. They are
individuals or groups of individuals who enjoy getting out and using
the land and find meteorites. They can keep what they find but can
not sell it. There is no permit required for this.
Note it does NOT clarifiy ownership for the casual collector. The
fact they say you can not sell it suggests a finder is NOT the owner.

The second type of user is the researcher, scientist, or museum
curator who is collecting for their research or exhibit in a museum or
other educational institutions. This DOES require a permit. The
permit will be issued, if approved, under the authority of the
Antiquities Act. The meteorite is still federal property, i.e., the
government is responsible for the care of the specimen because it is
required to be kept in perpetuity by the institution for the public's
benefit and enjoyment. It has the status of a national treasure, to
be cared for with certain requirements to preserve the specimen.
There are no fees for this type of permit because it is benefiting the
public.


The third type of user is a commercial collector or dealer. I called
them ?professionals.? BLM calls them Commercial. They are out to
make a profit from what they collect from public lands. As with other
commercial commodities that the BLM is responsible for, e.g., sand and
gravel, coal, oil and gas, solar energy, wind energy, etc., they are
required by various laws to collect basically a ?royalty? that gets
returned to the general Treasury?s public funds. This type of activity
requires a permit and must be evaluated for environmental impacts
under the National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA) and other various
environmental laws. The processing of the permit and the environmental
evaluations are part of the fees to process a permit. In addition,
there may be a fee associated with monitoring, if it is required.
Professionals who collect for museums and charge museums a fee are
still considered commercial collectors, and require a permit.

The BLM is using 43 CFR 2920 in regards to reviewing a permit
application, fees, fair market value, etc. The CFR's are fairly
clear. A local office in Arizona estimates the the permit process can
take up to 185 days, which is the current time it is taking.

As per 34 CFR 2920.2-1(a), it is highly recommended that you discuss
the proposal as soon as you can with the authorized officer in an
area. The authorized officer would be the one to approve the permit
based on 2920.2-1(b). There is a possibility that the AO would
determine that this could be a minimum impact permit as per 2920.2-2,
because recovery of the meteorite material is usually from the surface
with very little impacts during surface collection.

Two things are imperative..
First, the local authorized officers need to be educated in the
collection of meteorites and of critical importance, the need to
recover fresh fallen meteorites as soon as possible.
Second, based on conversations with BLM representatives, institutions
such as those that study and curate meteorites can and should file
permit applications that cover an entire state in a pro-active manor
so that they or their volunteers can collect freshly fallen meteorites
immediately after a fall. Still, this is up to the authorized officer
for the state.

The bottom line is that no one has any rights to collect meteorites on
federal lands for profit or for science without permission from the
BLM in the form of a permit. Science and dealer-hunters are those
affected the most. It was made apparent the BLM knows who many of
them are. Time will tell how this works out.

I am only sharing information here. Most all of this can be
referenced to communications with a BLM representative at a national
level.

Jim


Jim Wooddell


On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 5:12 PM, Norm Lehrman <nlehrman at nvbell.net> wrote:
> Jim & all,
>
> Commercial users always had to have permits. Permits always took their
> time. This is not new Rockhounders were always prohibited from commercial
> endeavors. This is not new. Meteorite hunters were lumped in with
> rockhounders
> until now. The only real change that I can see is the change in poundage
> limits---a major change for sure, but how many of us have had years where
> the 10
> pound limit would've been a problem? It can happen, but quite rarely. I
> have
> recovered hundreds of meteorite (fragments) in Nevada, but nowhere near 10
> pounds per year. Probably the main point of all this is that we are now
> under
> scrutiny and attracting explicit personalized regulation where before we
> were
> pretty much under the radar. However, the "new" explicit meteorite
> regulations
> are mostly not new, but rather, a formal restatement of long-standing
> policies
> governing rockhounding on BLM-managed lands.
>
> Norm
>
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Received on Tue 02 Oct 2012 01:21:18 PM PDT