[meteorite-list] Hammer fall term (this poor poor horse)

From: John Hendry <pict_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Thu, 14 Jun 2012 23:44:20 +0300
Message-ID: <EB903E35A6EA426C9D9F91169A9D6F41_at_Geologist>

Michael,

great expositon, and a good example of what I was thinking about. However I
am still failing to parse the language used to square with what would be the
normally understood meaning in the english language. If I may quote your
analysis here and there.

> Let me put it this way - New Orleans is a recent example of an
> unwitnessed hammer that is considered a fall.
Got it.

> In this particular case, nobody directly witnessed the fall or the damage
> being done.
Understood.

> if it is a
> hammer in the true and accepted sense, then it could be called a
> "hammer fall" or "witnessed fall" or "observed fall" or just a "fall"

Having cognitive issues at this juncture. If it isn't witnessed, but it is
considered a 'hammer fall', then how can 'hammer falls', in their entirity,
be a subset of witnessed or observed falls. Surely the definition of fall
must therefore include unobserved meteorite arrivals (i.e. unobserved hammer
falls).You cannot have a witnessed unwitnessed event. Well not in my book
anyway. Then again I am not Orwell.

Personally, I think it's bad nomenclature, but I can easily imagine how this
sort of stuff arises. A few weeks ago after reading some of the many Sutters
Mill accounts from the field I went for an idle stroll along a deserted
track in rural Ukraine. I noticed in the distance some semilustrous
subspherical objects, and for a while on my approach my imagination was
giving rise to mild tachycardia. On intimate inspection I found some nicely
dimpled droppings from a deer or something. After recovery from this
crushing disappointment, I thought it would be appropriate to propose a new
subclass of Leaverite called 'Meteorshite'. However thinking on this now,
all meteorshites would not necessarily be leaverites. A bedouin coming
across the wrong sort of Camel Donga (ok mixing continents here but give me
some latitude please), might not be thinking leaverite, he might be thinking
campfire for barbeque.

Regards,
John





----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael Gilmer" <meteoritemike at gmail.com>
To: "John Hendry" <pict at pict.co.uk>
Cc: "Meteorite List" <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Thursday, June 14, 2012 10:09 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Hammer fall term (this poor poor horse)


> Hi John and List,
>
> Good question. Let me attempt to answer. If I fail, perhaps Capt.
> Blood will chime in or another hammerhead will jump to the rescue.
>
> All hammers are falls, because if a hammer falls and nobody is around
> to notice it, it will never be discovered....and is therefore not a
> hammer or a fall.
>
> Let me put it this way - New Orleans is a recent example of an
> unwitnessed hammer that is considered a fall. When the New Orleans
> meteorite fell, penetrated the house and left a path of minor
> destruction (writing desk, etc), nobody was home. The owners were out
> and did not come home to find the cosmic damage until later. In this
> particular case, nobody directly witnessed the fall or the damage
> being done. If I recall correctly, there were no indirect witnesses
> as well - no radar track, no fireball video, no other witnesses on the
> ground. The find was determined to be a fall based on - the freshness
> of the material found, the testimony of the homeowners, and the
> obvious damage caused by this material.
>
> Met Bull states that the New Orleans meteorite is a fall, so it is
> therefore a "observed fall" or "witnessed fall" in officially-approved
> nomenclature and accepted use amongst the majority of collectors and
> dealers. Additionally, some hammerheads may refer to it as a "hammer
> fall". Also of note, New Orleans is a single stone fall, therefore
> the New Orleans meteorite is a "hammer stone" because it struck a
> house and manmade objects.
>
> Under different circumstances, the New Orleans meteorite may have gone
> unnoticed and unreported. The lower 9th Ward of New Orleans is
> desolate today, as a result of lingering damage from hurricane
> Katrina. Large stretches of homes and businesses are vacant and
> falling into disrepair. There are squatters, homeless persons, gang
> elements, and other transients that reside in the area. The same is
> true for other areas of New Orleans to varying degrees. If the stone
> had fallen in one of these houses, with no first-hand witnesses, it is
> likely to lay undiscovered and be carted off to the landfill when the
> city finally bulldozes the property. In such a case, the fall and
> damage were never noticed, it is never reported, no material is ever
> recovered, and the meteorite is never officially recognized or named.
>
> Also keep in mind, the criteria for officially approving a meteorite
> as a "fall" has changed to some degree over the years. Or could say,
> the criteria was more rigidly enforced in some publications than
> others. There are several cases of witnessed falls where the witness
> reports are several years or more removed from recovery of specimens
> on the ground. Some fall dates have uncertain dates or just a date
> range (summer of 18xx, etc). Some finds could be regarded as falls
> and there is some debate or uncertainty around the circumstances (or
> find location) that resulted in a fall classification being rejected.
>
> So, what I am getting at in a rambling fashion is this - if it is a
> hammer in the true and accepted sense, then it could be called a
> "hammer fall" or "witnessed fall" or "observed fall" or just a "fall"
> - depending on whether or not the term is being used officially or
> just casually.
>
> Best regards,
>
> MikeG
>
> PS - I think this horse is now officially pulverized beyond
> recognition. To continue this discussion line any further will
> require someone to acquire a new horse for consideration and possible
> flogging.
>
> --
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> Galactic Stone & Ironworks - MikeG
>
> Web: http://www.galactic-stone.com
> Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
> Twitter: http://twitter.com/GalacticStone
> RSS: http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
> -----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> On 6/14/12, John Hendry <pict at pict.co.uk> wrote:
>> Any hammer finds recorded? i.e. there's a big stone in the attic and a
>> hole
>>
>> in the roof, but nobody saw it fall.
>>
>> John
>>


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Received on Thu 14 Jun 2012 04:44:20 PM PDT