[meteorite-list] Katol India meteorite - Forbidden Fruit

From: Richard Montgomery <rickmont_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sat, 14 Jul 2012 20:31:20 -0700
Message-ID: <27F05150CFDB42E9B065A0BBFC2EBAF4_at_bosoheadPC>

As not an IMCA member, I watch this discussion with a focused ear. Optimism
for any outcome is a good direction to aim.

Relatively new to this forum (just a few years on the List...although maybe
it's way more, I'm aging) I find it both interesting, sometimes painful and
sometimes comical to watch the drama. Normally I delete-delete-delete the
banter, unless it is a discussion that warrants merrit. I never delete the
science....

This one ranks along the "painful" lines, because it seems to me that
disputes of legit authenticity, pedigree authenticity questions, legality of
import, etc on-and-on can be best resolved privately until and unless there
is a threat to all of us.

Of course, the last caviat may be important, but lets hope not.

-Richard Montgomery





----- Original Message -----
From: "Anne Black" <impactika at aol.com>
To: <jasonutas at gmail.com>; <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2012 4:50 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Katol India meteorite - Forbidden Fruit


> Hello Jason, Greg, and all,
>
> 2 very important facts to remember at all times:
>
> - IMCA Board Members are not required to sit in front of their computers
> 24/7, just in case someone has a question or a problem. We are allowed to
> have a life.
>
> - Anything the IMCA Board decides to say or do will be said or done in
> PRIVATE. And only in Private.
>
> Anne M. Black
> www.IMPACTIKA.com
> IMPACTIKA at aol.com
> Vice-President of IMCA
> www.IMCA.cc
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jason utas <jasonutas at gmail.com>
> To: Meteorite-list <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> Sent: Sat, Jul 14, 2012 5:13 pm
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Katol India meteorite - Forbidden Fruit
>
>
> Ditto Michael. Your personal beef with me and the IMCA for booting
> you is sad, but you screwed up in a large way, multiple times. Way to
> brush off the topic of unreturned museum donations yet again.
>
> Almahata Sitta was issued an export permit by the University of
> Khartoum. Whether that is legal in the eyes of the government there
> is open to debate. Either way, the pot's calling the kettle black.
>
> These meteorites were not stolen. As you say, case closed.
>
> Jason
>
> On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 4:07 PM, Greg Catterton
> <star_wars_collector at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> I am not attacking you by any means. Not like your blacklist website
> you have.
> I am simply pointing out the IMCA has FAILED to police its own members and
> allow
> them to sell illegal meteorites! I got my Almahatta Sitta from Anne Black,
> IMCA
> VP... Talk to her about the legal issues of it as she sold it to me.
>> My NWAs are not from Algeria FYI... Please.... lets name some names
> and make
> it clear that there is ALOT of illegal meteorites being sold by IMCA
> members and
> the group has failed to clean house for the violations of the code of
> ethics
> they swear by so much!
>>
>> Again, this is not about me, this is about YOU and other IMCA members
> breaking
> the IMCAs rules and ethics codes and the lack of enforcement the IMCA is
> showing. Lets be honest, you crucify me for a failed museum I tried to
> open
> while YOU ARE SELLING STOLEN METEORITES!!!!!!
>>
>>
>>
>> Greg Catterton
>> www.wanderingstarmeteorites.com
>> On Ebay: http://stores.shop.ebay.com/wanderingstarmeteorites
>> On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/WanderingStarMeteorites
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: jason utas <jasonutas at gmail.com>
>> To: Meteorite-list <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>> Cc:
>> Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2012 7:00 PM
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Katol India meteorite - Forbidden Fruit
>>
>> Greg,
>> Like your NWA's (maybe from Algeria), Camel Donga (no export permit)
>> and Almahata Sitta (possibly legal at best) on ebay -- to say nothing
>> of everyone's Sulagiri and most of the Canyon Diablo on the market
>> today? How about those Sikhote's you're offering? Exported before
>> Russia cracked down on exports, I take it? Please.
>>
>> I can name several people who donated to your museum who you still
>> haven't refunded.
>>
>> There's a difference between cheating people and offering a new
>> meteorite for sale, but I wouldn't expect you to see the difference.
>>
>> Keep attacking me, and me alone. We all know what's going on here.
>>
>> Jason
>>
>> On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 3:46 PM, Greg Catterton
>> <star_wars_collector at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> 1. You know more then well I was told it was Mifflin. I FULLY
> REFUNDED
> EVERYONE. Case closed. YOU can "shove off" I had several still not return
> material to me even though they were refunded..., including Mike
> Cottingham, and
> John Helm.
>>>
>>> 2. I spent several thousand of my money to try to open the museum.
> It failed.
> What can I say? I tried... Again, you can "shove off"
>>> 3. I have returned EVERYTHING donated minus one person who I have
> talked to
> about it. YOU did nothing yet run your mouth... again, "shove off...
>>>
>>> 4. WHAT I DID/DO DOES NOT MAKE IT RIGHT THAT YOU SELLING ILLEGALLY
> EXPORTED
> MATERIAL AND KNOW AS MUCH!!! I didnt know about the mifflin, you know the
> laws
> about this, and choose to ignore it!
>>>
>>> your comments are pathetic. YOU are breaking international laws, and
> are an
> IMCA member to boot... Where is the IMCA right now when you are selling
> ILLEGALLY EXPORTED METEORITES? What are they going to do with you breaking
> numerous IMCA rules? ANYONE from the IMCA care to comment or will they
> remain
> quite as that usually do when one of the good ol boys break the rules?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Greg Catterton
>>> www.wanderingstarmeteorites.com
>>> On Ebay: http://stores.shop.ebay.com/wanderingstarmeteorites
>>> On Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/WanderingStarMeteorites
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: jason utas <jasonutas at gmail.com>
>>> To: Meteorite-list <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>>> Cc:
>>> Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2012 6:34 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Katol India meteorite - Forbidden Fruit
>>>
>>> Hello Greg,
>>> The gall you must have to pass on thousands of dollars of fake
>>> material, take donations for a good cause, flake on the cause (but
>>> keep many of the donations) and then rag on me for selling
> *accurately
>>> described material*...just shove off. You've done more harm to this
>>> community on your own than most others have been able to manage in
> the
>>> past fifteen years.
>>> Jason
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I would have written a shorter letter, but I did not have the time.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Jul 14, 2012 at 9:23 AM,
>>> <wanderingstar at wanderingstarmeteorites.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Its Commonly known meteorites from India are illegal without export
>>>> permits, but yet Suligiri and now Katol is offered by many IMCA
> members
>>>> for sale. Guess the meteorite police, IMCA member and seller of this
>>>> (Katol) Jason Utas needs to add himself to his blacklist for selling
>>>> illegal meteorites! Question is, where is the IMCA to take action
>>>> against jason for illegally exporting or receiving these for sale?
>>>>
>>>> Greg C,
>>>>
>>>> -------- Original Message --------
>>>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Katol India meteorite - Forbidden
> Fruit
>>>> From: Me Teor <m3t30r1t3man at gmail.com>
>>>> Date: Sat, July 14, 2012 11:39 am
>>>> To: Shawn Alan <photophlow at yahoo.com>
>>>> Cc: Meteorite Central <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>>>>
>>>> Dear Shawn
>>>> You are absolutely correct. It is illegal to collect meteorites in
>>>> India. And meteorites are government property. The authority for
> this is
>>>> the Geological Survey of India. And as far as I know, they never
> trade
>>>> or deal with any individuals or private institutions. There cannot
> be
>>>> any export papers as export is banned.
>>>>
>>>> Although I wonder how having a export paper or certificate helps ?
>>>>
>>>> If a specimen is up for sale, it is definitely out of the country
> and
>>>> has been exported.
>>>>
>>>> By the way does anyone have a analysis report on this new find ?
>>>>
>>>> M.E.
>>>>
>>>> On 14-Jul-2012, at 3:32 AM, Shawn Alan <photophlow at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello Listers,
>>>>>
>>>>>> From my understanding, meteorites that fell or are found after
> 1885 in
> India would be forwarded to the Government Geological Museum which would
> take
> over possession of the meteorite? If so, how is Katol exempt from this, or
> was
> Katol sold by the Museum? For those who have gotten some of this meteorite
> fall,
> will their meteorites come with export papers like how Canadian falls are
> handled?
>>>>>
>>>>> Shawn Alan
>>>>> IMCA 1633
>>>>> eBay store
>>>>> http://www.ebay.com/sch/ph0t0phl0w/m.html?
>>>>> http://www.meteoritefalls.com/
>>>>> ______________________________________________
>>>>>
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Received on Sat 14 Jul 2012 11:31:20 PM PDT