[meteorite-list] Second experiment confirms faster-than-light particles gps accuracy

From: Marc Fries <mfries8_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sun, 20 Nov 2011 09:30:00 -0800
Message-ID: <BLU0-SMTP189AA9EF89E43DE3B82907AF1CA0_at_phx.gbl>

Howdy all

     There's a potential meteorite fall in Canada that may be worth
y'all's attention. And yes, "y'all's" is a word.

     Fireballs occur on a regular basis and I try not to post to the
list very often, but this one is especially interesting.

http://radarmeteorites.wordpress.com/2011/11/15/western-ontario-09-nov-2011-0936-utc/

Cheers,
Marc Fries


On 11/20/11 9:21 AM, Steve Dunklee wrote:
> This article contains gps info and accuracy . It states it depends on the earths movement and other factors and gives an accuracy of 14 nanoseconds. A 60 nanosecond difference in measurements is way off the accuracy of the gps clocks.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effects_of_relativity_on_GPS#Relativity
>
> cheers
> Steve Dunklee
>
> --- On Sat, 11/19/11, JoshuaTreeMuseum<joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com> wrote:
>
>> From: JoshuaTreeMuseum<joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com>
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Second experiment confirms faster-than-light particles
>> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>> Date: Saturday, November 19, 2011, 2:07 AM
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Matson, Robert D."
>> <ROBERT.D.MATSON at saic.com>
>> To: "JoshuaTreeMuseum"<joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com>;
>> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>> Sent: Friday, November 18, 2011 6:44 PM
>> Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Second experiment confirms
>> faster-than-light particles
>>
>>
>> Hi Phil,
>>
>> It was my understanding that the mystery of the CERN
>> faster-than-
>> light-speed neutrino result was solved over a month ago:
>> failure
>> to account for the relativistic motion of the GPS clocks
>> used to
>> time the neutrinos.
>>
>> GPS satellites orbit in planes inclined 55 degrees relative
>> to
>> the equator, coincidentally somewhat parallel to the
>> neutrino
>> flight path bearing on the ground. From the satellite's
>> perspective,
>> both the positions of the neutrino source and the neutrino
>> detector
>> are changing: in this particular case, from the perspective
>> of the
>> GPS clock, the detector is moving towards the neutrino
>> source, and
>> consequently the distance travelled by the particles -- as
>> measured
>> in the frame of the clock -- is shorter than the distance
>> measured
>> on the ground. As a result, the neutrinos should arrive
>> about 32
>> nanoseconds early: an amount that must be doubled because
>> the same
>> error occurs at each end of the experiment. So the total
>> correction
>> is 64 nanoseconds: almost exactly what the OPERA team
>> observed.
>>
>> If they ran the experiment a second time and got the same
>> result,
>> it seems to me that it is only confirming a prediction of
>> special relativity. --Rob
>>
>> ---------------------
>>
>> It seems unbelievable that the relativistic satellite
>> motion has not been brought to their attention. I mean if
>> you guys know about it, wouldn't they? I've also read
>> elsewhere about this effect and how it could be skewing the
>> results. I find it hard to believe they don't know about
>> this and would not make the necessary corrections.
>>
>> Phil Whitmer
>>
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Received on Sun 20 Nov 2011 12:30:00 PM PST