[meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!

From: mafer at imagineopals.com <mafer_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2011 05:52:18 +0100
Message-ID: <d54070069ce6e9dc4220da8cb84aa57c_at_>

I bet that the Chinese used their own calendar system.


On 5:44:32 am 07/05/11 MexicoDoug <mexicodoug at aim.com> wrote:
> Hi Mark,
>
> I meant "it ought to be Julian" in the sense that it is the Julian
> calendar system I believe is used by astronomers for dates before
> 1582, since we are by default dealing with the Holy Roman empire's
> calendar - "our calendar", which makes me believe the July 4 date all
> over the place by default would be Julian. Certainly not as a moral
> statement out of me of what calendar is superior! All calendars that
> work are fine with me! I like the Venusian-Mayan one a lot.
>
> Back to the question about the supernova that created the Crab
> Nebula, I still would guess it is JULIAN. I'm not sure if you are
> suggesting that Julian is being / has been dropped or if the date is
> Gregorian or none of the above - and just to observe it ;-) which is
> good advice, too. But knowing if I just Googled Meeus but couldn't
> find anything on Calendar usage in astronomy. I do recall screwing
> around with his algorithms and and dealing with royal pains in the
> butt made simple for his creative mind - using Julian day and date
> problems in his workbook style text, but it's been a very long time...
>
> I found this online from Fred Espenak of NASA who is the eclipse guru
> and has done many historical calculations, so it re-enforces that:
>
> "The Julian calendar is used for all dates up to 1582 Oct 04. After
> that date, the Gregorian calendar is used. Due to the Gregorian
> Calendar reform, the day after 1582 Oct 04 (Julian calendar) is 1582
> Oct 15 (Gregorian calendar). Note that Great Britain did not adopt
> the Gregorian calendar until 1752. For more information, see
> Calendars."
> ref: http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/SEhelp/calendar.html
>
> As to having a standard calendar, I couldn't agree more with you that
> it would simplify thing, but no matter how you deal with this as you
> mention it is always a headache for anyone who just wants to get
> answers quick. Even in the American colonies, all of the founding
> American fathers pretty much converted their birthdays since the new
> calendar was adopted here until the mid 1700's. I wonder how it felt
> to change everyone's birthday ... or I'm wondering if they actually
> kept celebrating on their Julian dates. Yes, here is meteorite-man
> Thomas Jefferson's design for his grave monument and epitaph, showing
> his birthday (O.S.) old system (Julian) of April 2, 1743.
>
> As to whoever did the specific conversions to determine the July 4,
> 1054 date from the ancient Chinese observations attributed to the
> Crab Nebula supernova ... they know :-(, but heck ... it happened a
> few thousand years earlier anyway, not when the light happened to
> reach Earth, yeah probably on a July 4 ... good cop-out to exit stage
> left
> http://www.hark.com/clips/mfrzzzplsb-stage-left
> ;-)
>
> Kindest wishes
> Doug
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: mafer at imagineopals.com
> To: MexicoDoug <mexicodoug at aim.com>
> Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2011 11:32 pm
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!
>
>
> The Gregorian calendar represents a generalized conversion so that
> things
> are easily kept in perspective between the sciences and the rest of
> the world. And thus, the terms Current Era (CE) and Before Current
> Era (BCE) have come into use and they do not represent Julian
> Calendar timelines.
>
> You could also add the Egyptian, Mayan, and Hebrew calendars if you
> really
> want to confuse the issue and there are those who seem to have
> obtained post grad degrees with methods to reconcile the various
> calendars so that
> all dates within each match up.
>
>
> And since some predate the Julian Calendar, which hold the superior
> claim?
> Which is the most easily used and more commonly used?
>
>
> BTW the Crab Nebula is one of the most beautiful of formations and
> one that
> many people have seen, even if they wouldn't recognize it.
>
>
>
> On 4:15:42 am 07/05/11 MexicoDoug <mexicodoug at aim.com> wrote:
> >
> > It ought to be Julian since that was in effect ... or else all the
> > references would have to say something about the re-adjustment of
> > the date, but that's just an opinion! In astronomy, generally the
> > 1582 conversion is respected by astronomers if I recall - I.e.,
> > before that time events are on the Julian Calendar, and afterwards
> > Gregorian, even if they nation of the observation was still on the
> > Julian date; usually that doesn't matter and by convention the
> > expression I time I believe changes in 1582. Jean Meeus's
> > incredibly useful books, if I had them would have an excellent
> > discussion of the subject, but I don't have my references with me.
> > Some other list member could look it up as Meeus'd be the expert.
> >
> > Best wishes
> > Doug
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Patrick Wiggins <paw at wirelessbeehive.com>
> > To: MeteorList <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> > Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2011 10:12 pm
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!
> >
> >
> > I've often wondered and maybe someone here can answer.
> >
> > Since 1054 was long before the 1582 conversion from the Julian to
> > Gregorian
> > calendar, is the July 4 date that gets mentioned for the first
> > sighting of
> > supernova a Julian date or has it been converted to Gregorian?
> >
> > ???
> >
> > patrick
> >
> >
> > On 04 Jul 2011, at 10:25, Gary Fujihara wrote:
> >
> > > Cosmic Fireworks: On July 4, 1054, Chinese astronomers observed a
> > "guest star"
> > in the constellation Taurus, the result of a star exploding or
> > going Supernova.
> > At mag -6, SN1054 (Supernova of 1054) became about 4 times brighter
> > than Venus,
> > was visible in daylight for 23 days, and lasted a period of two
> > years. Today we
> > can still see remnants of SN1054 as the Messier Object 1 (M1) Crab
> > Nebula.
> > >
> > > http://bigkahuna-meteorites.com/_M1.jpg
> > >
> > > Oh, and for those terrestrially bound in the USA, Happy Fourth of
> > July!
> > >
> > > Gary Fujihara
> > > Big Kahuna Meteorites (IMCA#1693)
> > > 105 Puhili Place, Hilo, Hawai'i 96720
> > > http://bigkahuna-meteorites.com/
> > > http://shop.ebay.com/fujmon/m.html
> > > (808) 640-9161
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Received on Tue 05 Jul 2011 12:52:18 AM PDT