[meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!

From: MexicoDoug <mexicodoug_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2011 00:44:32 -0400
Message-ID: <8CE08E5594BFD92-1B44-4623D_at_webmail-d139.sysops.aol.com>

Hi Mark,

I meant "it ought to be Julian" in the sense that it is the Julian
calendar system I believe is used by astronomers for dates before 1582,
since we are by default dealing with the Holy Roman empire's calendar -
"our calendar", which makes me believe the July 4 date all over the
place by default would be Julian. Certainly not as a moral statement
out of me of what calendar is superior! All calendars that work are
fine with me! I like the Venusian-Mayan one a lot.

Back to the question about the supernova that created the Crab Nebula,
I still would guess it is JULIAN. I'm not sure if you are suggesting
that Julian is being / has been dropped or if the date is Gregorian or
none of the above - and just to observe it ;-) which is good advice,
too. But knowing if I just Googled Meeus but couldn't find anything on
Calendar usage in astronomy. I do recall screwing around with his
algorithms and and dealing with royal pains in the butt made simple for
his creative mind - using Julian day and date problems in his workbook
style text, but it's been a very long time...

I found this online from Fred Espenak of NASA who is the eclipse guru
and has done many historical calculations, so it re-enforces that:

"The Julian calendar is used for all dates up to 1582 Oct 04. After
that date, the Gregorian calendar is used. Due to the Gregorian
Calendar reform, the day after 1582 Oct 04 (Julian calendar) is 1582
Oct 15 (Gregorian calendar). Note that Great Britain did not adopt the
Gregorian calendar until 1752. For more information, see Calendars."

ref: http://eclipse.gsfc.nasa.gov/SEhelp/calendar.html

As to having a standard calendar, I couldn't agree more with you that
it would simplify thing, but no matter how you deal with this as you
mention it is always a headache for anyone who just wants to get
answers quick. Even in the American colonies, all of the founding
American fathers pretty much converted their birthdays since the new
calendar was adopted here until the mid 1700's. I wonder how it felt to
change everyone's birthday ... or I'm wondering if they actually kept
celebrating on their Julian dates. Yes, here is meteorite-man Thomas
Jefferson's design for his grave monument and epitaph, showing his
birthday (O.S.) old system (Julian) of April 2, 1743.

As to whoever did the specific conversions to determine the July 4,
1054 date from the ancient Chinese observations attributed to the Crab
Nebula supernova ... they know :-(, but heck ... it happened a few
thousand years earlier anyway, not when the light happened to reach
Earth, yeah probably on a July 4 ... good cop-out to exit stage left

http://www.hark.com/clips/mfrzzzplsb-stage-left
;-)

Kindest wishes
Doug


-----Original Message-----
From: mafer at imagineopals.com
To: MexicoDoug <mexicodoug at aim.com>
Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2011 11:32 pm
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!


The Gregorian calendar represents a generalized conversion so that
things
are easily kept in perspective between the sciences and the rest of the
world. And thus, the terms Current Era (CE) and Before Current Era (BCE)
have come into use and they do not represent Julian Calendar timelines.


You could also add the Egyptian, Mayan, and Hebrew calendars if you
really
want to confuse the issue and there are those who seem to have obtained
post grad degrees with methods to reconcile the various calendars so
that
all dates within each match up.


And since some predate the Julian Calendar, which hold the superior
claim?
Which is the most easily used and more commonly used?


BTW the Crab Nebula is one of the most beautiful of formations and one
that
many people have seen, even if they wouldn't recognize it.



On 4:15:42 am 07/05/11 MexicoDoug <mexicodoug at aim.com> wrote:
>
> It ought to be Julian since that was in effect ... or else all the
> references would have to say something about the re-adjustment of the
> date, but that's just an opinion! In astronomy, generally the 1582
> conversion is respected by astronomers if I recall - I.e., before
> that time events are on the Julian Calendar, and afterwards
> Gregorian, even if they nation of the observation was still on the
> Julian date; usually that doesn't matter and by convention the
> expression I time I believe changes in 1582. Jean Meeus's incredibly
> useful books, if I had them would have an excellent discussion of the
> subject, but I don't have my references with me. Some other list
> member could look it up as Meeus'd be the expert.
>
> Best wishes
> Doug
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Patrick Wiggins <paw at wirelessbeehive.com>
> To: MeteorList <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> Sent: Mon, Jul 4, 2011 10:12 pm
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT - Happy Crab Nebula Day!
>
>
> I've often wondered and maybe someone here can answer.
>
> Since 1054 was long before the 1582 conversion from the Julian to
> Gregorian
> calendar, is the July 4 date that gets mentioned for the first
> sighting of
> supernova a Julian date or has it been converted to Gregorian?
>
> ???
>
> patrick
>
>
> On 04 Jul 2011, at 10:25, Gary Fujihara wrote:
>
> > Cosmic Fireworks: On July 4, 1054, Chinese astronomers observed a
> "guest star"
> in the constellation Taurus, the result of a star exploding or going
> Supernova.
> At mag -6, SN1054 (Supernova of 1054) became about 4 times brighter
> than Venus,
> was visible in daylight for 23 days, and lasted a period of two
> years. Today we
> can still see remnants of SN1054 as the Messier Object 1 (M1) Crab
> Nebula.
> >
> > http://bigkahuna-meteorites.com/_M1.jpg
> >
> > Oh, and for those terrestrially bound in the USA, Happy Fourth of
> July!
> >
> > Gary Fujihara
> > Big Kahuna Meteorites (IMCA#1693)
> > 105 Puhili Place, Hilo, Hawai'i 96720
> > http://bigkahuna-meteorites.com/
> > http://shop.ebay.com/fujmon/m.html
> > (808) 640-9161
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Received on Tue 05 Jul 2011 12:44:32 AM PDT