[meteorite-list] 25143 Itokawa and meteorites

From: MexicoDoug <mexicodoug_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2011 18:20:47 -0400
Message-ID: <8CE325589E30C5B-80C-DFB9_at_webmail-m127.sysops.aol.com>

Larry wrote:

"[possible that we] do not have any meteorite samples from Ceres as it
is not near any resonances that would transport pieces to
Earth-crossing orbits as we see for Vesta."

Hi Larry, - That sort of said, interestingly enough the planetoid Vesta
itself is further away from a strong 'resonance' than is the planet
Ceres!

Vesta - 2.36 (gap: 2.5, delta = 0.14 AU)
Ceres - 2.77 (gap: 2.82, delta = 0.05 AU)

Of course, as empty as the asteroid quarter may be, over time, impacts
have done a lot of our sample return dirty work ;-)

Kindest wishes
Doug

PS The question of whether we have any Cererian samples in our
collections is the most delightful can of worms for another thread !





-----Original Message-----
From: lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu
To: Craig Moody <meteoritesnorth at hotmail.ca>
Cc: MetList <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Fri, Aug 26, 2011 5:26 pm
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] 25143 Itokawa and meteorites


Hello Craig:

The theory of a single large object being pulled apart (or exploding as
with Krypton) was shown pretty much proven wrong more than 30 years ago.
If one looks at the various classes of asteroids, their distribution in
the asteroid belt, and potentially related meteorite types, one finds
that
most of the objects in the asteroid belt and the meteorites derived from
them were never larger than a few hundred kilometers in diameter, HEDs
being the exception and even then, still less than 500 km in diameter.
It
is likely that Ceres, Pallas, and Vesta were the largest object to have
survived planet formation (in the asteroid belt, as there are bigger
things in the Kuiper Belt) and these also survived subsequent breakup.

Larry
PS It is very possible that we do not have any meteorite samples from
Ceres as it is not near any resonances that would transport pieces to
Earth-crossing orbits as we see for Vesta.

>
> Hello list
>
> I still agree with the theory that almost all of the asteroids in the
> belt, were once part of a single planetoid, that was torn apart by the
> gravitational tug of war between the Sun and Jupiter. Also, people
assume
> that the asteroid belt likes like the one from The Empire Strikes Back
> (Where Han Solo flies the Millennium Falcon INTO an asteroid field
with
> hundreds of them bouncing off each other like a pinball game.) They
are
> actually very far apart. Orbital distance is maintained via speed and
> mass because (Insert scientific techno-mumbo-jumbo here), so there's
bound
> to be the occasional collision. It could be violent or it could be
like a
> gentle touch. What reaches us here on earth, depends which piece of
the
> pie got bumped our way this time.
>
> Also, is it possible that a fall in 683BC could also have a "sibling"
fall
> in 2011 with both pieces being ejected from the parent body during a
> violent impact. One was travelling much slower than the other, and it
> took an extra 2694 years to get here. They would be identical (if it
> weren't for terrestrial weathering).
>
> Space has lots of really cool of things!......Because it's really,
REALLY!
> BIG!!
>
> Craig
> IMCA 6276
>
>
>> From: david.childs7 at btinternet.com
>> To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>> Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2011 17:12:12 +0100
>> CC: almitt at kconline.com; karrnaka at email.de
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] 25143 Itokawa and meteorites
>>
>> Itokowa as Doug has said, is only a couple of blocks' size, and I
>> certainly
>> have not heard of Itokowa suggested as source of anything, except the
>> Japanese did land something on it a while back and took some samples.
>> I would suggest ther source of LL's would MORE than likely be from
>> Vesta, as
>> it seems that Vesta is the best candidate for a lot more as well.
>>
>> Best Wishes
>> David R Childs
>> IMCA 5112
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "MexicoDoug" <mexicodoug at aim.com>
>> To: <almitt at kconline.com>; <karmaka at email.de>;
>> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>> Sent: Friday, August 26, 2011 4:20 PM
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] 25143 Itokawa and meteorites
>>
>>
>> > Isn't this exciting news Al & Martin!
>> >
>> > Al from wikipedia:
>> > "S-type asteroids are of a siliceous (stony) composition, hence the
>> name.
>> > Approximately 17% of asteroids are of this type, making it the
second
>> most
>> > common after the C-type."
>> >
>> > and from the Nature link:
>> > "S-types are commonly found on the inner fringes of the belt,"
>> >
>> > So it is not fair to call puny Itokawa even one of many "parent
body"
>> > asteroids; only that a reasonable composition match for LL
chondrites
>> was
>> > found in what might be representative of its surface dust. The
>> asteroid
>> > is only 2 X 2 X 6 city blocks in size or so ... but interesting
since
>> its
>> > orbit gets closer to our neighborhood.
>> >
>> > There is a case for all Vestoids being from Vesta, but such a
common
>> > origin has not (yet?) been identified for S-type asteroids. With
the
>> > exception of Vesta, no asteroid parent bodies are suspected with
any
>> > certainty to be such grand-parent bodies. Grandparent, meaning it
is
>> > directly linked ... rather than one of a billion possibilities. It
is
>> > extremely unlike that "all LL's" are from Itokawa and probably
>> unlikely
>> > that *any* are from it as well.
>> >
>> > al wrote:
>> > "Wonder if all the LL's are from Itokawa or if we have more than
one
>> > parent body source for those?? "
>> >
>> > Kindest wishes
>> > Doug
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: al mitt <almitt at kconline.com>
>> > To: karmaka <karmaka at email.de>; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>> > Sent: Fri, Aug 26, 2011 9:02 am
>> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] 25143 Itokawa and meteorites
>> >
>> >
>> > Greetings,
>> > So Itokawa is the parent body of the LL chondrites. Asteroid Hebe
is
>> > thought (by spectra) to be the parent body of most or all the H
>> > chondrites. Asteroid Eros the L4 chondrites and Asteroid Bozemcova
the
>> L6
>> > chondrites.
>> > Wonder if all the LL's are from Itokawa or if we have more than one
>> parent
>> > body source for those??
>> > Best!
>> > --AL Mitterling
>> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "karmaka" <karmaka at email.de> To:
>> > <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com> Sent: Thursday, August 25,
2011
>> 2:40
>> > PM Subject: [meteorite-list] 25143 Itokawa and meteorites
>> >> Hello list here some interesting new articles about the analysis
of
>> the
>> >> Itokawa matter:
>> >
http://www.space.com/12733-earth-meteorites-stony-asteroid-mystery.html
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
http://www.physorg.com/news/2011-08-earth-bound-asteroids-stony.html[http://www.space.com/12733-earth-meteorites-stony-asteroid-mystery.html]
>> >>
>> >> Martin
>> > ______________________________________________ Visit the Archives
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Received on Fri 26 Aug 2011 06:20:47 PM PDT