[meteorite-list] www.venusmeteorite.com - what are your opinions on this claim

From: Randall Gregory <randall_gregory_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 13 Feb 2007 11:39:41 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <467863.66905.qm_at_web52102.mail.yahoo.com>

  Ken,

   
  I will be happy to share with you some of the data that I've collected at the impact site including videos and pictures. All of the pictures, videos, and samples are stored at my apartment in Lima. I am currently in Arequipa and expect to travel to Lima within the next two weeks.
   
  I hope you understand that I can not provide you with the exact location of the crater until I have secured the mining concession rights to the area. When I legally have title to the area, I will make the location known and provide first access only to scientists that study impact sites, then to other interested parties. When the studies are concluded, I will start excavation of the crater.
   
  I can give you the approximate location.
   
  Coordinates: 15?59'18"S - 72?30'43"W for the general area of the crater.
   
  Coordinates: 16?00'01.71"S - 72?37'08.16"W seismic epicenter recorded by the National University of Peru (UNSA) intensity 3.8 Richter
   
    Coordinates: 16?20'59.77"S - 72?46'57.07"W seismic epicenter recorded by the Geophysical Institute of Peru (IGP) located in Arequipa, 200 kilometers from the seismic event recorded it at 4.0 Richter giving the approximate TNT for seismic energy yield of 1 kiloton (small atomic bomb).
   
  All seismic stations including a station in Chile recorded this event at the exact time the eyewitnesses reported the explosion and resulting dust cloud. What I find to be remarkable is the accuracy of the seismic data, all within 30 km.
   

  I've also enclosed a copy of a meeting that I had with seismologists from the Geophysical Institute of Peru. The orginal text was in Spanish which I have translated to English. Unfortunately, I have to blank out the exact coordinates. Many people have strongly cautioned me about giving out too much information. I hope you understand, realize, and appreciate how much work has been put into this discovery. This is just the tip of the iceburg.
   
    On a side note, you might recall an image of a face on Mars that was captured some years back. We now have a similar image on Earth. Go to Wikimapia and type "rostro de dios" in the search box, click on the name, read the caption, and pan out. People said it looked like the "Face of God" and the name stuck. This image is clearly visible from about 3000ft. to over an altitude of 110 miles. Coordinates are: 16"20'22.78S - 71"57?40.61W for Google Earth.
   
  Comments appreciated.

   
  Randall
   
  E-Mail dated:
   
    ENGLISH VERSION
   
  I wish to thank all that attended our meeting yesterday for your time and effort. Maybe we can help the scientific community in Peru and the United States to a better understanding of our universe. I am pleased that I could assist you in calibrating your seismic equipment.
   
  Before my wife and I left for Lima, we asked her father to submit a small article to the local newspaper to announce the discovery and to thank the UNSA for their support in this discovery. We never expected that the newspaper would sensationalize this story.
   
  During the last expedition, my team and I made two excursions to the impact area. My intention was to fully document the impact zone and to expand the search to see if other structures may exist that would contribute to the discovery. Since it is difficult to estimate the amount of energy released on impact, I believe that it was important to completely document the total area. There may be multiple impacts, secondary impacts, impactites, fused sand, tektites, micro-tektites, with each contributing a piece of information to this story of a hyper velocity impact.
   
  The one thing that I hoped would not happen was for other people to go to the impact area and contaminate what is still a structure in a natural state. To document what we talked about, the GPS coordinates of what we called (blanked out) which from this point you can see the crater is (blanked out) with another vantage point closer to the impact is (blanked out). I trust the people at IGP and please (por favor) The only thing I ask from you is that you keep this information from public knowledge until I have completed my study.
   
  I have video recorded some parts of the expedition that I would also like to share with you at some time in the very near future. The definitions of some of the terms that I used are listed below.
   
       
  Impactites - glassy, molten rocks can also be produced directly by the high heat and pressure of a meteorite impact or just its shock wave, without projecting the molten material up into our atmosphere. Molten glass and rocks fractured by high pressure have been found near impact craters
   
    Tektites - small, pebble-like glassy objects of Earth material that have been melted by meteorite impact, splashed up into our atmosphere, and fallen to Earth again under gravity. They often acquire aerodynamic shapes when they partially melt on their return journey.



   
  Sincerely,
   
  Randall Gregory
   
   
  SPANISH VERSION

   
      Excusar por favor mi espa?ol. He incluido una versi?n inglesa de mi E-mail tambi?n.
   
  Deseo agradecer todos que assistieron a nuestra reuni?n ayer para que tu hora y esfuerzo ayuden a la comunidad cient?fica en Per? y los Estados Unidos a una comprensi?n mejor de nuestro universo.
   
  Antes de que mi esposa y yo nos fu?ramos para Lima, pedimos que su padre sometiera un art?culo peque?o al peri?dico local para anunciar el descubrimiento y para agradecer el UNSA por su ayuda en este descubrimiento. Nunca cont?bamos con que el peri?dico sensationalize esta historia. Este acontecimiento desafortunado me ha hecho suspender mis estudios por un per?odo del tiempo.
   
  Durante la expedici?n pasada, mi equipo y yo hicimos dos excursiones al ?rea del impacto. Mi intenci?n era documentar completamente la zona del impacto y ampliar la b?squeda para considerar si otras estructuras pueden existir que contribuir?an al descubrimiento. Puesto que es dif?cil estimar la cantidad de energ?a lanzada en impacto, creo que era importante documentar totalmente el ?rea total. Puede haber impactos m?ltiples, impactos secundarios, impactites, arena fundida, tektites, micro-tektites, con cada uno contribuyendo un pedazo de informaci?n a esta historia de un impacto hiperactivo de la velocidad.
   
  La una cosa que esperaba no suceder?a estaba para que la gente vaya al ?rea del impacto y contamine cu?l sigue siendo una estructura en un estado natural. y del m? proveer? de ti la informaci?n adicional que tengo en un per?odo del tiempo corto. Los coordenadas del GPS qu? llamamos de (blanked out) que de este punto primero puedes ver el cr?ter son (blanked out) otra posici?n ventajosa m?s cercano al impacto es (blanked out).
   
  Conf?o en que la gente en el IGP y por favor (please) la ?nica cosa que pido de ti es que guardas esta informaci?n del conocimiento p?blico hasta que he terminado mi estudio.
   
  Tengo v?deo registrado algunas partes de la expedici?n a que tambi?n quisiera compartir con ti en alg?n momento en muy cercano el futuro. Las definiciones de algunos de los t?rminos que utilic? se enumeran abajo.
   
   
   
  Impactites - vidrioso, las rocas fundidas se pueden tambi?n producir directamente por el de alta temperatura y la presi?n de un impacto del meteorito o apenas de su onda expansiva, sin la proyecci?n del material fundido para arriba en nuestra atm?sfera. El cristal fundido y las rocas fracturados por la alta presi?n se han encontrado cerca de los cr?teres del impacto
   
  Tektites - peque?o, guijarro-como los objetos vidriosos del material de la tierra que han sido derretidos por impacto del meteorito, salpicados para arriba en nuestra atm?sfera, y ca?dos a la tierra otra vez bajo gravedad. Adquieren a menudo formas aerodin?micas cuando derriten parcialmente en su viaje de vuelta.
   
    Sinceramente,
  Randall Gregory

   
   


   
  
ken newton <magellon at earthlink.net> wrote:
  Randall,
I think we would all be interested in seeing photos of the crater you
found and your suspect meteorites rather than the roundabout way you
began this discussion. As to whether anyone can assist you, depends if
you are seeking truth or a preconceived idea.

If you are really seeking the truth, I offer one piece of advice, don't
rely on your own conclusions. Let the evidence (test results) as
evaluated by two experts be the final say so. If the first does not lead
you where you thought it might, get a second opinion of the evidence and
if nothing has changed, let it drop.

Sadly, there are too many persons that have obsessed over simple objects
to their folly. Instead of heeding correct expert analyses they jump to
the next expert hoping for a different result, critical of any who do
not share their imagined expectation. "Why can't it be this rare thing
or that rare thing" they ask. (see - http://tinyurl.com/34zlbf) The
fruitage of obsession is frustration and paranoia. Not a good road to
be on.

Best Wishes on the recovery of the main mass,
Ken Newton



Randall Gregory wrote:

> Ken,
> Thank you for you reply and the link to webwrongs. Yes, it's theolitic
> basalt with a melted surface. I hope you will keep an open mind and
> take the time to read this. Please take a look at the Geophysical
> Meteors on the web link you provided.
>
> I have had many communications with the author of that website, Dr.
> Andrei Ol'khovatov. If you would look at the Peruvian meteorite
> sighting on that website you will see that it was a mid-day witnessed
> fall and the impact was recorded by 3 different seismic stations
> (Arica Chile, Arequipa Peru, and Lima Peru). Dr. Mutsumi Shisutka
> (Institute Geophysical Peru) and Dr. Armando Minaya UNSA (University
> National San Agustin) assisted me by providing seismic recordings, and
> in turn, I provided them with the actual location of the crater. The
> actual location of the crater was important in helping to adjust their
> equipment in refining earthquake epicenters.
>
> The main mass at this current time in in-extractable due to the
> terrain but efforts are underway contracting with a heavy equipment
> operator to bulldoze a small dirt road. I have talked with the local
> government about buying a 100 hectares mining concession encompassing
> the crater to protect it. When the main mass is uncovered, I'll know more.
>
> It took me 2 years and 6 separate expeditions to find the crater. I
> lived for a time in the area of El Castillo with a family that
> witnessed this event. With satellite photos, eyewitness accounts,
> seismic data, detailed charts and assistance provided by the national
> university I searched for the impact area. I found it and I have all
> the proof. What is interesting is that some of the specimens I
> collected near the crater are identical to one of the pictures in the
> venusmeteorite.com.
>
> I went to ACTLABS in Lima, Peru to have a sample analyzed but they
> lacked the equipment necessary. They told me that ACTLABS.com (Canada)
> might be able to provide this analysis.The type of testing I need is
> "space weathering". Specifically, solar to galactic ray tracks, oxygen
> isotope fractionation patterns, radionuclide measurements, and noble
> gas analysis. I would like to find a planetary geologist who will take
> to time to look at a specimen and read the reports but in reality, my
> expectations are low.
>
> I wrote to Dr. Korotev some time ago, but he too has doubts and his
> area of expertise is lunar meteorites. I can tell you that some of the
> rocks near the crater have a black splatter with the same
> characteristics as the samples. In an area of tan to rust colored
> terrain, a rock that looks like melted black plastic is unmistakable.
> I talked with a Peruvian government hydrologist (Jorge Mena) that
> works in this general area and he told me he has never seen rocks like
> that in his 40 years in the field searching for underground aquifers.
>
> Can you speculate what would a inner-planet meteorite look like? Does
> the fact that it fell mid-day have any significance? Would you
> expect a mid-day fall? Are mid-day falls rare? And if 20 years ago
> someone said that they had a meteorite that might just be from Mars,
> would anyone believe them?
>
> I have a lot of evidence but no definitive proof that these are
> meteorites or where they might have come from. I'm hoping you can help
> me find the answer. I am sending a copy of this email to Dr. Korotev
> in the hope that he would be kind enough to provide a introduction
> to Dr. Brett Gladman or Dr. Akira Yamaguchi if possible.
>
> Randall
>
>
>
>
> Hi Randall,
> It's basalt. Here are some more meteorwrong sites (bottom half)
> http://home.earthlink.net/~magellon/webwrongs.html
> Best,
> Ken Newton
>
>
>
> Randall Gregory wrote:
>
>> Has anyone seen this website and if so, what are your opinions as
>> to the validity of his claims that the meteorites found are from
>> Venus. And how would anyone know if a meteorite came from one of
>> the inner planets? Would cosmic ray exposure and oxygen isotope
>> be useful. What tests would be definitive?
>>
>>
>> Randall
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Received on Tue 13 Feb 2007 02:39:41 PM PST