[meteorite-list] Further precision re "Bessey Specks"

From: E.P. Grondine <epgrondine_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Wed Oct 18 13:58:56 2006
Message-ID: <20061018175853.37600.qmail_at_web36908.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Hi all -

We're ignoring the important issues of display and
presentation here.

I seem to remember that Dean had imbedded the specks
in $100 lucite cubes. Way too expensive for young
people, who sometimes loose things.

While the little glass tubes that Greg Hupe used will
fit well in little hands, I am worried about the
glass, which limits the age of the recipient.

I seem to remember little plastic boxes with
magnifying lenses built into the top of them, but I
don't think these would be very elegant/pretty, and
the tubes are better.

Some kind of flat embossed plastic holder with a
magnifier molded into it might be ideal, say a blank
one on which labels could be printed on a computer and
then applied.

What kind of presentation do you think would be ideal
for Bessey Specks?

There's a lot of lunar and martian dust being created
by slicing NWAs, and it might as well be put to a very
good use.

good hunting,
Ed

--- tracy latimer <daistiho_at_hotmail.com> wrote:

> For myself, I've always considered a Bessey Speck to
> be anything smaller
> than a match head or grain of rice. Adequate to
> fill in a space in a
> collection where larger samples are unavailable or
> prohibitively expensive,
> but no good for seeing lithologies without a
> microscope or 10x lens,
> minimum.
>
> Tracy Latimer
>
> >From: Michael L Blood <mlblood_at_cox.net>
> >To: MexicoDoug <MexicoDoug_at_aim.com>,Adam Hupe
> <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>
> >CC: Meteorite List
> <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> >Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Further precision re
> "Bessey Specks"
> >Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2006 13:25:43 -0700
> >
> >Doug and all,
> > This is closer - but to be truly a "Bessey
> Speck" a specimen
> >must be small enough to VERY, VERY EASILY fit in
> the smallest
> >sized gelatin capsule (they come in a variety of
> sizes) and should
> >be difficult or nearly difficult to see for anyone
> with less than 20/20
> >vision. Also referred to as a "Micro-mini" to
> differentiate from what Adam
> >referred to as a "micromount" which can be as large
> as 1" X 1" !
> >"Micromount" is well established as fitting in a 1
> X 1 - though this
> >has been "challenged" with the considerably larger,
> yet still small
> >membrane boxes, which I am sure many would consider
> "micromount"
> >as opposed to "macromount" which are ROUGHLY those
> that would
> >fit in a 2" X 2" box.
> > Back to Bessey Speck - it MUST be VERY
> small to qualify,
> >and certainly MUCH, MUCH smaller than 1" X 1" !
> > I regret I must run off to teaching a
> couple of classes - this is
> >much more interesting to me than arguments.
> > Michael
> >
> >
> >on 10/17/06 12:58 PM, MexicoDoug at
> MexicoDoug_at_aim.com wrote:
> >
> > > Hello Adam, Listees,
> > >
> > > Bessey Speck
> > > (1) A commercially marketed,
> submillimeter-sized, granular or
> >irregular,
> > > intentionally broken petreus meteoritical
> fragment which collectors
> >prize as
> > > a token possession of an expensive meteorite or
> of one with limited
> > > distribution, typically used more as a
> conversational piece or to
> > > satisfactorily fill a primal participatatory
> instinct for collection and
> > > coat-tailing on the "wow-effect" of possession
> of the parent specimen.
> > > Compare to "Particle", "Stardust", "Crumb",
> "Micro" and "Micromount".
> > > (2) Any, almost microscopic-sized particle
> originating from a larger
> >(macro)
> > > meteorite specimen.
> > >
> > > Note, I'm not disagreeing with Adam' response to
> Ed in the sense that
> >the
> > > term micromount is a term in the toolbox,
> although I think the word
> >particle
> > > is more descriptive for most of our uses. I am
> agreeing with Michael
> >Blood
> > > that the term Bessey Speck has a place.
> > >
> > > The questionably honorific term "Bessey Speck"
> seems like a much more
> > > descriptive term to me than micromount for many
> collectors. To me a
> > > "micromount" implies some sort of serious grand
> plan of scientific
> > > investigation or illustration of specific
> attributes. Size alone
> >doesn't
> > > count, as much as purpose. For example,
> Stardust particles are not
> > > micromounts unless prepared that way despite
> Adam's definition, and they
> >are
> > > not Bessey Specks, though micro-Besseyspeckies
> are certainly
> >hypothetically
> > > possible.
> > >
> > > "Bessey Speck" consideres that not all particles
> commercially sold in
> >venues
> > > like eBay find scientific use regardless of who
> is doing the selling.
> >That's
> > > where Bessey Speck is a unique and interesting
> term. Adam's definition
> > > clearly has the weighted meaning toward a
> usually higher "scientific"
> >use in
> > > observing material properties: appreciation with
> binocular microscope,
> > > better developed crystals, etc... The short
> comment in that definition
> > > "obtaining for less," especially given the
> profit and pleasure motives
> > > between buyers and sellers, really seems quite
> out of place to me.
> >Adam's
> > > post wasn't clear, at least for me, if he
> disagreed with the use of the
> >term
> > > Bessey Speck or just was offering Ed an
> alternate (which I definitely
> >agree
> > > with Adam in doing).
> > >
> > > I am not comfortable with the term micromount
> being more properly used
> >for
> > > specimens purposefully shattered into small bits
> with a sledge for the
> > > unadulterated and pure pleasure of collectors
> filling holes in their
> > > collections, a majority of which are not "better
> appreciating" their
> >samples
> > > in a binocular microscope which many don't have
> nor have too much
> >motivation
> > > to get.
> > >
> > > Didn't "Bessey Speck" usage start with Dean's
> Mars rock sales many years
> > > before most of our times? I am trying to
> remember Kevin Kitchinka's
> > > comments in "The Art of Meteorite Collecting"
> (don't have handy here)
> >where
> > > an explanation of the etymology of this colorful
> term was published and
> >my
> > > Mars' comment references. Bessey Specks,
> though, gets the point across
> >much
> > > better for me! It's ll in the intended use and
> market. While I don'
> >think
> > > a "Micromount" is an appropiate common sense
> description for something
> >not
> > > carefully prepared and mounted to exhibit some
> characteristic, heck - if
> > > their not even carefully mounted...
> > >
> > > So, unless Dean objects to being immortalized in
> this fashion, that is
> >my 2
> > > centavos.
> > > Doug
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>
> > > To: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 2:53 PM
> > > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Re: "Bessey
> Specks"
> > >
> > >
> > > The term micromount has been used for decades to
> describe this type of
> > > specimen.
> > >
> > > Micromount:
> > >
> > > Micromount is term used by mineral collectors
> and rockhounds to describe
> > > mineral specimens that are best appreciated
> using a binocular
> >microscope.
> > > Micromount specimen collecting has a number of
> advantages, specimens
> >take up
> > > less space, rare minerals can be obtained for
> less and smaller crystals
> >are
> > > more perfectly developed.
> > >
> > >
> > > All the best,
> > >
> > > Adam
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "E.P. Grondine" <epgrondine_at_yahoo.com>
> > > To: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, October 17, 2006 7:07 AM
> > > Subject: [meteorite-list] Re: "Bessey Specks"
> > >
> > >
> > >> Hi Michael, list -
> > >>
> > >> I see you list your Bessey Specks as "frags".
> > >>
> > >> (Your price of $25 seems very fair for Nakla
> specks,
> > >> but I already picked up Mars Bessey Specks for
> > >> childrens' gifts at Christmas from Hupe.)
> > >>
> > >> Clearly, there is a need for a more elegant
> term than
> > >> "Bessey Specks" for these. Does anybody have
> any
> > >> proposals? If not, is Dean(?-stroke damage)
> Bessey
> > >> going to be immortalized by having these
> formally
> > >> named after him?
> > >>
> > >> Hupe also sent the Bessey specks in small tubes
> > >> suitable for young hands, along with 1 nice
> pair of
> > >> cards (BTW I need a second pair of cards for
> the
> > >> second set of tubes, Greg), instead of gelatin
> > >> capsules.
> > >>
> > >> Perhaps microscope slides would be more
> suitable for
> > >> adult use, but as I don't remember any
> discussion of
> > >> these on the list, I'm bringing it up now.
> > >>
> > >> good hunting -
> > >> Ed
> > >>
> > >> --- Michael L Blood <mlblood_at_cox.net> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Greetings fellow space treasure lovers,
> > >>> This post includes a fabulous, large
> iron
> > >>> and an entire new
> > >>> page of historic calls.
> > >>>
> > >>> FIRST:
> > >>> A beautiful 6.5 Kg / 14.3 Lb S-A Shrapnel
> piece that
> > >>> appears for all
> > >>> the world to be an oriented shield on one side
> and a
> > >>> flat, oriented
> > >>> specimen heading to the left in a downward
> angle on
> > >>> the other side.
> > >>> This piece includes an custom build
> display
> > >>> stand to facilitate
> > >>> a very impressive display of its virtues.
> > >>> If no one snaps this up on sale it
> will go
> > >>> into my catalog
> > >>> at $3,250- but the first to contact me will
> take it
> > >>> in this sale for 2,750-
> > >>> (price includes shipping and insurance inside
> the
> > >>> US)
> > >>> This spectacular piece can be seen
> at:
> > >>>
> > >>>
> http://community.webshots.com/album/554884324rEfSPa
> > >>>
> > >>> SECOND:
> > >>> I have set up an entire page dedicated to
> hammers ?
> > >>> meteorites that have
> > >>> struck man made objects, animals or humans.
> This is
> > >>> a collection of the
> > >>> most impressive of all the recorded meteorite
> falls
> > >>> in history. I have 35
> > >>> different recorded falls (including Bessey
> Specks of
> > >>> Sylacauga, Yurtuk and
> > >>> Burnwell). About half of the falls can also be
> found
> > >>> elsewhere with diligent
> > >>> searching ? and you will find my prices are as
> low
> > >>> as anyone's. The others
> > >>> cannot be had anywhere else. They are priced
> > >>> according to cost. This page
> > >>> is
> > >>> worth checking out even if you don't want to
> buy
> > >>> anything ? it was 5 years
> > >>> in the making and includes historical photos,
> links,
> > >>> etc. See at the URL
> > >>> below:
> > >>>
> > >>>
> http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/Hammers.html
> > >>>
> > >>> Pieces on the Hammer page will be marked
> "SOLD" as
> > >>> orders come in ?
> > >>> so, if it is still listed when you email me,
> it is
> > >>> available.
> > >>>
> > >>> PayPal preferred (sent to this email
> > >>> address) Visa/Mastercard
> > >>> and personal checks gladly accepted.
> > >>> Happy Hunting! Michael
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
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> > >
> > >
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Received on Wed 18 Oct 2006 01:58:53 PM PDT