AW: [meteorite-list] Repository of photos...
From: Bernhard Rems <rendelius_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sun Nov 21 13:55:21 2004 Message-ID: <000001c4cffb$a37d1100$bc4a2fd5_at_rendhome> :-) I think you will be getting tired of hearing this, but I invested a lot of time to create a free repository for meteorite photos at http://www.meteoritegallery.com I know this doesn't fit scientific standards, but hey, it's a beginning and could be very useful at least for collectors wanting to know how a certain meteorite looks like. That is, if people upload pics there. All I can say is: USE IT, FOLKS. Bernhard -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- Von: meteorite-list-bounces_at_meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces_at_meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Nicholas Gessler Gesendet: Sonntag, 21. November 2004 19:48 An: John Birdsell; Jeff Grossman Cc: meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Repository of photos... Hi Jeff, et al, Regarding a repository of photos, I too think it would be extraordinarily useful. To this end, I noticed that Marvin Kilgore has a book in press to partially satisfy this need. It would be nice to have some professional reviews of it. Jeff, Alan, are you game? Marvin had a galley proof at the Costa Mesa show. Perhaps he'd loan a copy for review? Cheers, Nick At 10:34 AM 11/21/2004, John Birdsell wrote: >Hello Jeff and thanks for your email. I think a repository of high quality >photos of type specimens would be extremely useful for the entire >meteorite community. > >Cheers >-John > >Jeff Grossman wrote: > >>There are several reasons for this result. Among these are: >> >>1) Not all scientists are equally skilled at classifying meteorites. >>2) Not all samples are representative of the whole. It used to be that a >>lab would have the entire mass to examine and could see the entire >>structure. With meteorites in commercial hands, they often just get a >>small chip. Given that lots of chondrites and achondrites are breccias, >>this can be a problem. >>3) Some meteorites are borderline between types. Many of us try to make >>a decision as to which it is, and two people might come down on opposite >>sides of the line. If it actually matters, somebody will do careful work >>and publish on the subject. In most cases the error doesn't >>matter. Researchers all know that classification errors of this sort happen. >>4) Nobody has ever standardized the way that brecciated meteorites should >>be described. Someday this will be fixed. >>5) Some areas of meteorite classification are controversial (e.g., the >>use of type 7). >> >>We already have a consortium of labs... it is all of those labs that >>agree to house type specimens and make them available for research >>whenever an important scientific question arises. We already have a >>network for data sharing... it includes the Meteoritical Bulletin and the >>numerous scientific journals that publish abstracts and peer-reviewed >>research. If there is a need for a repository of photos, for example, one >>could be set up in short order. Is there? >> >>On the question of pairing... for most meteorites, pairing studies are of >>little scientific interest and not worth taking the time to do. >>Visual pairings are almost worthless. For the important meteorites, >>pairings get worked out in the scientific literature over time. This may >>be unsettling for some dealers, but that's the way it is. >> >>jeff >> >>At 11:11 AM 11/21/2004, Matt Morgan wrote: >> >>>Just to add a note... >>>There is a fundamental scientific problem of classifying meteorites. >>> >>>Try sending two pieces of the same meteorite to different labs. Chances >>>are you will get different results. >>>For instance, I have "L5's" that came back as "L4's" and "L6's". >>>"Regolith" this and "Primitive" that. >>>I heard the same situation happening for NWA 1929, either howardite OR >>>eucrite. I understand some of it is "interpretive". >>> >>>The system itself is flawed. >>> >>>Ideally, we need an NWA consortium of labs to correct this and have type >>>specimens on hand. >>> >>>This SEEMS to be an easy fix, but university politics plays a huge role. >>> >>>So all you scientists who study NWA's, how about a network for meteorite >>>"data sharing"? It will make ALL our lives easier... >>> >>>Matt Morgan >>>Mile High Meteorites >>> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: meteorite-list-bounces_at_meteoritecentral.com >>>[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces_at_meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Rob >>>Wesel >>>Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 2:38 AM >>>To: Michael Farmer; meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com >>>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers >>> >>> >>>While I truly believe this practice is ultimately costly to the >>>collector, >>>truer words have never been spoken. Thanks Mike: >>> >>>"Virtually every dealer including myself has been or is guilty of this, >>>we are in the process of correcting the situation and to start people >>>MUST immediately comply or this will just spiral downward as we see >>>tonight." >>> >>>So, for now, we make it right. We follow the rules and pay out to prove >>>pairings. We wait longer to get to market and costs go up because repeat >>>lab >>>fees and repeat type specimens factor into prices per gram. I don't like >>>it >>>one bit but that's what we do. I will be finishing off my "likely >>>paired" >>>howardite as such but new specimens are already off to the lab, >>>specimens I >>>know are paired. >>>While I seriously doubt the law has any holding here, the NomCom asks >>>this >>>of us. Bottom line, if two folks buy bread from the same baker...they're >>> >>>eating the same bread. The full weight of this ruling will soon be felt >>>by >>>all as we bog down institutions who want to study meteorites with >>>incessant >>>pairings, not much grant money in pairings, not much recognition. But >>>this >>>is what we do...for now. >>> >>>Rob Wesel >>>------------------ >>>We are the music makers... >>>and we are the dreamers of the dreams. >>>Willy Wonka, 1971 >>> >>> >>> >>>----- Original Message ----- >>>From: "Michael Farmer" <meteoritehunter_at_comcast.net> >>>To: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com> >>>Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 7:56 PM >>>Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite numbers >>> >>> >>> > To clarify something that is obviously causing some problems in the >>> > meteorite world right now, I want everyone to know that >>> > NWA 788, 787, and NWA 482 are numbers that came from rather large or >>> > meteorites with hundreds of pieces bought during one of my >>>expeditions. >>> > The Hupes and many other people have the right to those numbers. >>> > Now, there are other numbers being widely used without proper title >>>(as Dr >>> > Grossman has stated publicly and with finality that people do not own >>> > numbers, but numbers are assigned to specific meteorite specimens and >>>must >>> > not be used with other meteorites just because you heard or someone >>>told >>> > you it is the same). >>> > Let's all please stop this practice as it is really hurting our >>>business >>> > and hobby. Virtually every dealer including myself has been or is >>>guilty >>> > of this, we are in the process of correcting the situation and to >>>start >>> > people MUST immediately comply or this will just spiral downward as we >>>see >>> > tonight. >>> > >>> > I perused eBay today and it is still rampant with sellers using >>> > numbers >>> > they seem to have drawn from a hat. So please ask you seller next time >>>you >>> > buy something, how they got that number, who it was assigned to and if >>>not >>> > them, just how they came to call it that. >>> > Mike Farmer >>> > >>> > ______________________________________________ >>> > Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com >>> > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> > >>> >>> >>>______________________________________________ >>>Meteorite-list mailing list >>>Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com >>>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >>> >>> >>>______________________________________________ >>>Meteorite-list mailing list >>>Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com >>>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> >> >>Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184 >>US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383 >>954 National Center >>Reston, VA 20192, USA >> >> >>______________________________________________ >>Meteorite-list mailing list >>Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com >>http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >______________________________________________ >Meteorite-list mailing list >Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Received on Sun 21 Nov 2004 01:55:14 PM PST |
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