[meteorite-list] Zagora "CR2" & "NWA 801"

From: Michael Farmer <farmerm_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Thu Apr 22 09:54:10 2004
Message-ID: <00d401c1be75$869ef520$0fd00140_at_computer>

Well, I have no problem with people using my numbers, if is clearly the same
item. If Dean couldnt distinuish between the CR and an H3 then something is
wrong with that picture. This is simply a dilema that we all must deal with.
I feel that it is fer better to lump the same meteorite under one number.
Otherwise, it looks like there are 10,000 CR2s when there are really only a
few. There is clearly no simple solution, but dont worry, it is almost over
so when they dry up in the near future, we wont have to worry about the
problem of so many meteorites.
Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Verish" <bolidechaser_at_yahoo.com>
To: "Meteorite-list Meteoritecentral" <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Monday, February 25, 2002 9:48 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] Zagora "CR2" & "NWA 801"


> No, Mike,
> I'm not suggesting that we test each stone.
>
> But the question I am asking should be of interest to
> you, too.
>
> Say, as in this case with NWA 801, you have gone to
> the trouble to get an NWA number AND a classification.
> So, now you know that your stone will appear in the
> Met. Bulletin along with its TKW. And now you can
> tell your customers that the slice they bought from
> you is from this "TKW" in the Met. Bull. This should
> enhance the value of your CR2, or at least make it
> more attractive to your customers. Your effort should
> be rewarded.
>
> But then, you find all your competitors calling their
> stones "NWA 801"! They are essentially reaping the
> benefits of your efforts. Or worse, the dilution
> caused by all their various "NWA 801" stones may
> negate the value of your genuine, classified mass. I
> would think this would be a concern of yours, as well.
>
>
> I was only trying to give credit to Dean for how he
> handled his "CR2" stones. Yes, I know the Nom Comm
> forced him to take a NWA number for each of his
> stones. And don't get me wrong, I hate all the
> numbers, too. I would rather that we had just one
> name for all these "obviously" similar stones, but the
> world is too complex and nothing is as simple as it
> should be.
>
> But in Dean's case, I think it worked out for the
> better. Dean clearly stated that his stones weren't
> classified and he used phrases like "probably a CR2",
> and "probably paired to NWA 801". Even knowing this,
> I still purchased from him one of his "CR2" stones
> known as NWA 1083.
>
> So, when I got it classified and it turned out to be a
> H3.7 S2 W3 (Fa 24.6+/-7.0%) ! ! !
> it was no big deal, because
> 1) he only said it was "probably a CR2", and
> 2) he never called it NWA 801.
>
> No harm, because this only effects my NWA 1083.
> Now, because it's classified, some researcher may find
> it of interest to test some of the other "CR2" stone
> and do a proper "pairings study".
>
> Does this "H3.7" classification mean we should test
> every one of these stones from Zagora? "No!", I say.
> But I would suggest that we be more prudent in how we
> apply names and probable classifications to the
> meteorites that we are marketing. I think it would
> make good marketing sense. In these situations, it
> may even be preferrable to agree on one common "trade
> name" for all these stones, as opposed to "borrowing"
> an officially approved name from the Bulletin.
>
> No, I'm not suggesting that we test every stone.
> It's just that I learned a lesson (the hard way) -
> that an unclassified stone is just that -
> it's an UNCLASSIFIED stone!
> So, an "unclassified CR2" can be nothing more! ;-)
>
> Bob V.
>
> ------------------ Original Message ------------------
> [meteorite-list] Zagora "CR2" & "NWA 801"
>
> Michael Farmer farmerm_at_concentric.net
> Mon, 25 Feb 2002 17:09:02 -0600
>
> Bob, are you suggesting that every singe stone needs
> to be tested individualy? The CR2 is about the easiest
> meteorite to recognize, when I go there and buy them
> all from one man, in a batch who shows me where he
> found them all, and they are clearly all CR2 pieces, I
> assume that they are the same and sell them as such.
> If you want each stone individually tested, then I
> need to know where to send the 3000 or so Gao pieces I
> have and ~500 Canyon Diablos to get them all
> confirmed.
> I admit that many chondrites can be a problem, but in
> something as distinct as the CR2 NWA 801 and the other
> #s already assigned, it seems to be a massive waste of
> time and resourses to duplicate data that is clear in
> a
> hand specimen.
> Mike Farmer
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Robert Verish" <bolidechaser_at_yahoo.com>
> To: "Meteorite-list Meteoritecentral"
> <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> Sent: Monday, February 25, 2002 4:00 PM
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Zagora "CR2" & "NWA 801"
>
>
> > Hello Dean and All,
> >
> > In the eBay auction that Charlie Devine refers to,
> > you stated:
> >
> > "Most dealers are just selling this meteorite as
> > NWA801 which is one of the meteorites from this
> > strewnfield that has been classified."
> >
> > If this is true Dean, this could become a big
> problem
> > for collectors. This could even make the valid
> > specimens of NWA 801 (from the classified stone)
> > suspect that they came from unclassified stones from
> > the same locality. How can we tell the difference?
> > At least you, Dean have gone to the trouble to
> obtain
> > NWA numbers for your stones. But many other people
> > aren't concerning themselves with making this
> > distinction. Even Charlie, in his original message,
> > equated the stone in your auction with his endpiece
> > of "this meteorite (NWA 801)" in his auction!
> >
> > What happens when one of these "NWA 801" stones on
> > eBay, (or any of the other "CR2" stones for that
> > matter) gets tested, and its classification comes
> > back as something other than "CR2"?
> >
> > Bob V.
> >
> > ------------------ Original Message ----------------
> > [meteorite-list] Zagora CR2 Inclusion
> >
> > Charlie Devine moonrock25_at_webtv.net
> > Mon, 25 Feb 2002 09:32:57 -0500 (EST)
> >
> > Dear List:
> >
> > Can anybody identify the inclusion in this specimen
> > of the Zagora CR2?
> > I have an endpiece of this meteorite (NWA 801) which
> > shows a 3.5mm x 2mm inclusion that is virtually
> > identical, in shape and color, to the inclusion
> shown
> > in this sample. So I'm wondering.....
> >
> > See:
> >
> http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1077561890
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Charlie
>
>
>
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Received on Mon 25 Feb 2002 10:27:29 PM PST