[meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Don't Find Any Exobiology Stuff

From: Dori Fry <dorifry_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 18:05:22 -0400 (EDT)
Message-ID: <1352994507.140410.1363385122626.JavaMail.root_at_md12.embarq.synacor.com>

Sterling,

Nobody knows what life is, plain and simple. The wisest, most wizened theologians and the brightest scientists in the latest techno-labs don't have a clue. Nobody knows what the ghost in the machine is. Or how it arose from matter.

What I said was life seems to arisen by chance on our planet, and therefore it could possibly happen again elsewhere.

You said: "Is our planet special?" Yes, our planet is incredibly special, it's the most perfect goldylocksy place ever!


Yes, 2500 yrs ago all they had were atoms. Nowadays we have quantum particles and a stringy, vibrating web of particle waves that can be two places at once. Matter may not be solid after all. An entirely new parallel universe may be created ever time we make a decision. There may be near infinite copies of each and every one of us. Physics is turning into metaphysics. Materialism as we know it may be fading away. There might be massless forces lacking a Boson that we know nothing about. (The Force.) Particles may have a simple consciousness. For all we know meteorites may be intentionally aiming for the Sahara's soft sands. (Comic relief and steering the thread back the physical world of meteorites.)


Phil Whitmer
Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum


----- Original Message -----
From: Sterling K. Webb <sterling_k_webb at sbcglobal.net>
To: JoshuaTreeMuseum <joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com>, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Fri, 15 Mar 2013 16:27:38 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Don't Find Any Exobiology Stuff

Phil, List

You said:
> Science cannot define life using current materialist, reductionism,
> physicalist methods. They think life, along with consciousness and
> intelligence are just chance random byproducts of chance random
> arrangements of organic molecules.

That is EXACTLY how science defines life.
All science is materialist, reductionism, and
physicalist. If you believe something else,
then whatever that thing is, it is NOT science.

Yet:
> I'm not ruling out life elsewhere in the Universe, because according
> to the laws of probability...

So, life can't arise by chance on OUR planet but
it CAN on some other planet. Would you explain
the logic of that to me? Or is our planet special?

2500 years of having the structure (and eventually
the workings) of matter explained by Leucippus,
Democritus, Epicurus, through Galileo, to Dalton,
Bohr, Heisenberg, Einstein, and hundreds of others,
and you still don't get it.

I'll give you a 2500-year-old quote that you can
repeat quietly to yourself until you DO get it:
"There are atoms and the void and nothing else."


Sterling K. Webb
------------------------------------------------------------------
----- Original Message -----
From: "JoshuaTreeMuseum" <joshuatreemuseum at embarqmail.com>
To: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Friday, March 15, 2013 1:50 PM
Subject: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Don't Find Any Exobiology
Stuff


> Mark,
>
> I agree. It's becoming painfully obvious Mars has always been
> lifeless. If it didn't happen there, where conditions were similar to
> Earth, with all the right ingredients and parameters, then I wouldn't
> hold my breath while looking for life in the rest of the Solar System.
> Abiogenisis is an extremely rare thing, maybe even a singularity.
>
> Science cannot define life using current materialist, reductionist,
> physicalist methods. They think life, along with consciousness and
> intelligence are just chance random byproducts of chance random
> arrangements of organic molecules.
>
> Trying to understand life by studying the physical properties of the
> building blocks, where they came from, whether or not the early Earth
> had a reducing atmosphere, etc., etc, is like trying to explain a Van
> Gogh by microprobing his paints.
>
> I'm not ruling out life elsewhere in the Universe, because according
> to the laws of probablility, if something happened once, no matter how
> weird, bizarre and unexplainable it was, there's a chance it will
> happen again.
>
>
> We'll know more in a million years.
>
> Phil Whitmer
> Joshua Tree Earth & Space Museum
>
>
>>>>Look deep underground (tough to do from Earth)> - That's fine if
>>>>your looking for Earth style microbes, but until we even formally
>>>>define life (and not just some grey area about self reproducing
>>>>molecules) would we know 'it' if we saw it?
>
>
>
> Seems to me if you chart the historical progress of the hunt for life
> on Mars it's getting a bit thin and desperate, in 100 years we have
> gone from theories of there being colonies of Martians with canals or
> forests to a small chance there may still be a few microbes hanging on
> deep underground near the equator, Nothing wrong with looking and we
> should, but at some point in the near future we should probably give
> up and start face to reality, and think about sending some resources
> elsewhere - where frankly the chances are a looking little bit higher,
> e.g Europa.
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
> [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of
> Michael Mulgrew
> Sent: 14 March 2013 19:04
> To: Sterling K. Webb; Meteorite List
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Stuff
>
> Sterling,
>
> Look deep underground (tough to do from Earth), any life remaining on
> Mars will likely be found there.
>
> Michael in so. Cal.
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Received on Fri 15 Mar 2013 06:05:22 PM PDT