[meteorite-list] Meteorites Reveal Another Way to Make Life's Components
From: Erik Fisler <phxerik_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 16:35:07 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <1331595307.18765.YahooMailNeo_at_web111905.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Breaking away from invisible men in the sky and back to science.. Amino acids alone make up 60 ppm of Murchison, by weight. PAHs make up 0.3% of its weight. Earth formed with huge quantities of organic molecules. Today?s biosphere has ~ 3 x 1041 C atoms. If the early Earth had this many C atoms all in building block molecules with ~ 10 C atoms each, that?s ~ 3 x 1040 total molecules. Say there are ~ 105 molecules with up to 10 C atoms (uracil, dihydroxyacetone, naphthalene, etc.). That means there are ~ 3 x 1035 copies of each molecule on Earth. The volume of Earth's oceans and land is < 1025 cm3. Each thimbleful (cubic centimeter) of ocean had > 3 x 1010 cm3 copies of each of these different organic compounds. Each one can bang into each other one in a matter of minutes, potentially making ~ 1010 new combinations. Each day, lightning, solar radiation, volcanic heat, heat from impacts, breaks apart molecules, making more new combinations possible. Mixing in the oceans increased the combinations possible. This went on, day after day after day, for 100 billion days (300 Myr) [Erik] ----- Original Message ----- From: Dick Lipke <RICHARDLIPKE at comcast.net> To: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Cc: Sent: Monday, March 12, 2012 3:15 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites Reveal Another Way to Make Life's Components I promise this is the last on this issue. I always believed religions were created after the first humans began to become aware what the meaning of death really meant. Maybe that's when emotions took a giant leap and evolved into affection and love.The creation of religion eased their grief by believing in a after life for the loss of a loved one or friend. ? ? Richard Lipke ----- Original Message ----- > Eric postulates... > > "And this might be offensive to some, and I'm > >sorry if offends, but speculating that an anthropomorphic deity > >started it, is pure speculation, because no one knows what happened > >before, in the beginning, and it creates the creator to explain the > >unexplained formation of the observable. Why can't the unexplained > >stop and start at "I don't know, lets find out." instead of "god did > >it". > > Eric, > > I think the attached article published in the national media today > will go a long way toward answering your question. This NASA scientist > is described by his fellow workers as an evangelical Christian that > insisted on proselytizing at work. > > http://www.centredaily.com/2012/03/11/3122308/suit-nasa-specialist-axed-over.html > > Most persons of faith believe they have had revealed to them the > entire creation story and aren't interested in anyone trying to change > their beliefs. They know, and I believe fear, that to accept any of > the science would mean having to strip whole pages out of what they > are taught is divine revelation. > > Respectfully, I suggest you give it up, or take it somewhere else. > > Count Deiro > IMCA 3536 > > > -----Original Message----- > >From: eric at meteoritesusa.com > >Sent: Mar 11, 2012 9:08 PM > >To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites Reveal Another Way to Make > >Life's Components > > > >Good points Richard, Michael, (I will apologize in advance for the > >length of this post; I started writing a couldn't stop) > > > >Divine Creation vs Natural Formation. That is the question. That is a > >VERY large part of why I love meteorites so much. Meteorites have > >allowed me a look into the universe and answer some very important > >personal, spiritual, and scientific questions as to the origins of > >Earth, the planets, and ourselves. Meteorites are keys to unlocking > >our past, the formation of Earth, the solar system, stars, galaxies, > >and ultimately the universe itself. > > > >The problem with the divine creation (anthropomorphic creator) > >hypothesis is that it's an assumption of observance. In other words > >the watchmaker paradox. The universe exists, how did it come to be? > >Something must have "created" it. Right? Not necessarily. That my > >friends is an absolute assumption. > > > >And the argument should stop right there, but it doesn't. Believers > >will argue that something can't come from nothing and non-believers > >will argue that everything came from what we perceive as nothing. > >(The > >Big Bang) Science and non-believers go one step further and say "We > >don't know what happened before the Big Bang." That is intellectual > >honesty and good science. And this might be offensive to some, and > >I'm > >sorry if offends, but speculating that an anthropomorphic deity > >started it, is pure speculation, because no one knows what happened > >before, in the beginning, and it creates the creator to explain the > >unexplained formation of the observable. Why can't the unexplained > >stop and start at "I don't know, lets find out." instead of "god did > >it."? > > > >Evolution, Panspermia, Transpermia, Abiogenesis, Planetary Science, > >Astrobiology, Astronomy, Anthropology, Archeology, they all help > >explain the universe and world around us. > > > >Meteorites specifically are absolutely a vital clue to unlocking the > >secrets of the universe because they (the asteroids and comets that > >make them) not only are they the very material that formed our > >planet, > >every single planet, planetesimal, asteroid, comet, meteoroid, and > >spec of dust floating around our star was once part of another star > >before, as are we. It's a cycle, a system, a circular system of > >formation and destruction, somewhere in between life formed. > > > >Why create a creator to explain the unexplainable? Why not instead > >use > >science to determine origins rather than speculate on a divine > >supernatural beginning. Empirical evidenced fact outweighs > >speculative > >assumption every time. We are in fact part of nature, not separate > >from it. We need not transpose an anthropomorphic creatot to explain > >something we don't yet know. > > > >Regardless of whether there is a divine creator, or not, no one can > >prove it empirically either way. (yet) That's what science is for. If > >there is, science will find out, if there is not, science will find > >out. Either way, the truth will only be the truth when we prove it > >with evidence, not speculative assumption of the observable. > > > >Regards, > >Eric > > > > > > > > > > > >Quoting Richard Montgomery <rickmont at earthlink.net>: > > > >> Hi Michael and List (a different Richard here!) > >> > >> Contrary to the often mis-conception that 'religion' and 'God' are > >> interchangeable...and considering the 'dangerous' ground upon which > >> a > >> discussion of this sort may be inappropriate for the meteoritical > >> discussion here....allow me this thought: > >> > >> A person of 'faith' may not rule out transpernmia in theory; it > >> simply > >> expands the pie. A 'religious' person tied tether-bound to a strick > >> doctrine may reject such an 'outlandish' notion out-of-hand, as it > >> disrupts the entire reality from which their foundation is built. > >> > >> In short, (in my small and insignificant yet human perspective), it > >> should be rational to allow both transpermia and a perspective of > >> God > >> that trancends all current 'views' of even Christianity, allowing > >> for > >> all three to co-exist....just a thought.... > >> > >> Richard Montgomery > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Blood" > >> <mlblood at cox.net> > >> To: "Dick Lipke" <RICHARDLIPKE at comcast.net>; "Meteorite List" > >> <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com> > >> Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2012 5:02 PM > >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorites Reveal Another Way to Make > >> Life's Components > >> > >> > >>> Hi Richard, > >>> > >>>? ? ? As an Anthropologist I can assure you all religions have NOT > >>> Viewed God as male - some were female and some were non-gender > >>> Specific "spirit." > >>> > >>>? ? ? Garry, I agree with you - interesting topic, but I fear a > >>>? ? ? good many > >>> On the list would see it as non-meteorite related in spite of the > >>> fact > >>> That transpermia (via meteorites) compels such a discussion about > >>> why > >>> People "of faith" would reject transpermia out of hand. They > >>> damned > >>> Near tortured Galileo to death for saying the world was not the > >>> center > >>> Of the universe (and he lived the remainder of his life under > >>> house arrest). > >>> > >>>? ? ? ? Religious persecution of scientific recognition of > >>>? ? ? ? inconvenient > >>> facts has always been part of history and continues to this day - > >>> most > >>> religions holding the view, "the way we see things IS the way > >>> things are" > >>> while others overtly state that view AND feel the DUTY to kill > >>> anyone > >>> when sees things differently - hence 9/11. > >>> > >>>? ? ? Weird, weird, weird & weirder. > >>> > >>>? ? ? Michael > >>> > >>> > >>> On 3/11/12 2:23 PM, "Dick Lipke" <RICHARDLIPKE at comcast.net> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Micheal, > >>>> That is an excellent point that has always baffled me and I could > >>>> never > >>>> understand the thinking > >>>> of any religion in this world. All the different Gods worshiped > >>>> world wide > >>>> have always been considered a male. > >>>> Which brings up the problem, "Which came first, the chicken or > >>>> the egg." > >>>> I think all these religions could be easier to swallow if their > >>>> God was a > >>>> female. > >>>> That would answer the question, she "God" was a female carrying > >>>> the first egg > >>>> that resulted > >>>> in the birth of the universe. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Richard Lipke > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>>>> A major element in the problem with most of those calling > >>>>> Themselves Christians these days is that they > >>>>> See God as an anthropomorphic individual. This makes it > >>>>> Difficult to see the "glory" or creation in anything other > >>>>> Than comic book images. > >>>>> > >>>>> They actually envision God as a big (male) human who > >>>>> Literally, with His hands, shaped Adam out of mud..... > >>>>> They cannot even see what a nearly perfect allegory that is > >>>>> For evolution arising from a primeval "soup." > >>>>> > >>>>> Evidence of transpermia is growing - but don't confuse > >>>>> Them with facts. > >>>>> > >>>>> Odd > >>>>> Michael > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> On 3/10/12 5:58 AM, "Dick Lipke" <RICHARDLIPKE at comcast.net> > >>>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> Years ago I got a lot of questionable looks concerning my > >>>>>> sanity > >>>>>> when I > >>>>>> brought up > >>>>>> the idea of meteorites being "the Johny Appleseed of of life on > >>>>>> Earth" to > >>>>>> members of my astronomy club. > >>>>>> Needless to say it resulted in many,many comments of out rage. > >>>>>> They reminded me of how it must have felt to be among the first > >>>>>> to refute the idea that Earth was the center of the Universe. > >>>>>> Lucky for me my kind of thinking came in 20th century, back > >>>>>> then > >>>>>> they still > >>>>>> burnt > >>>>>> people at the stake for being possessed by satin. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Richard Lipke > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- > >>>>>>> Meteorites Reveal Another Way to Make Life's Components > >>>>>>> ScienceDaily, March 9, 2012, > >>>>>>> http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120309104845.htm > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Meteorites Reveal Another Way to Make Life's Components > >>>>>>> Klaus Schmidt, March 10, 2012 > >>>>>>> http://spacefellowship.com/news/art27926/meteorites-reveal-another-way-to-m > >>>>>>> ak > >>>>>>> e-life-s-components.html > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> The paper is: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Burton, A. S., J. E. Elsila, M. P. Callahan, M. G. Martin, D. > >>>>>>> P. > >>>>>>> Glavin, N. M. Johnson, and J. P. Dworkin. A propensity > >>>>>>> for n-w-amino acids in thermally altered Antarctic > >>>>>>> meteorites. Meteoritics & Planetary Science. Article > >>>>>>> first published online: 8 March 2012 > >>>>>>> > >>> http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1945-5100.2012.01341.x/abstrac>>>> > >>> t > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> best wishes, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Paul H. > >>>>>>> ______________________________________________ > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Visit the Archives at > >>>>>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >>>>>>> Meteorite-list mailing list > >>>>>>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >>>>>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >>>>>> ______________________________________________ > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Visit the Archives at > >>>>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >>>>>> Meteorite-list mailing list > >>>>>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >>>>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >>>> ______________________________________________ > >>>> > >>>> Visit the Archives at > >>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >>>> Meteorite-list mailing list > >>>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >>> > >>> > >>> ______________________________________________ > >>> > >>> Visit the Archives at > >>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >>> Meteorite-list mailing list > >>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > >>> > >> > >> ______________________________________________ > >> > >> Visit the Archives at > >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >> Meteorite-list mailing list > >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > > > >______________________________________________ > > > >Visit the Archives at > >http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > >Meteorite-list mailing list > >Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > >http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > ______________________________________________ > > Visit the Archives at > http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ______________________________________________ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Received on Mon 12 Mar 2012 07:35:07 PM PDT |
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