[meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)

From: Graham Ensor <graham.ensor_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Mon, 16 Jan 2012 10:29:53 +0000
Message-ID: <CAJkn+kak9WscA0UqOoHeT1jrvksGo1qz=8fUe1ZAA-Pm35hzLQ_at_mail.gmail.com>

But is was more than a decade later that Viking got evidence that made
them realize what they had....would the investigations have been
different if they had known...or am I completely wrong with that?

Graham

On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 2:04 AM, Gary Fujihara <fujmon at mac.com> wrote:
> Indeed Zagami had an even shorter terrestrial age when first recovered and analyzed in laboratories around the world than the new Martian shergottite. ?What was missing were the suite of analytical technology today that can provide far greater insight into the meteorite that were not available in 1962, particularly in short-lived radionuclides.
>
> gary
>
> On Jan 15, 2012, at 3:27 PM, Rob Wesel wrote:
>
>> Zagami has and even shorter terrestrial age and has been in ample supply for study for the last 50 years.
>>
>> Rob Wesel
>> ------------------
>> Nakhla Dog Meteorites
>> www.nakhladogmeteorites.com
>> www.facebook.com/Nakhla.Dog.Meteorites
>> www.facebook.com/Rob.Wesel
>> ------------------
>> We are the music makers...
>> and we are the dreamers of the dreams.
>> Willy Wonka, 1971
>>
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Galactic Stone & Ironworks" <meteoritemike at gmail.com>
>> Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2012 11:43 AM
>> To: "Shawn Alan" <photophlow at yahoo.com>
>> Cc: "Meteorite Central" <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
>>
>>> Hi Shawn and List,
>>>
>>> It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites,
>>> but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and
>>> they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait
>>> for discovery. ?This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has
>>> a terrestrial age measured in months. ?That is exciting. ?It is so
>>> pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research
>>> it. ?Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best
>>> thing to sample recovery mission. ?Imagine how much it would cost to
>>> bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. ?Mother Nature just saved
>>> science billions of dollars. ?:)
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> MikeG
>>> --
>>> *************************************************
>>>
>>> Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
>>>
>>> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
>>> Facebook - ?http://tinyurl.com/42h79my
>>> News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
>>> Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
>>>
>>> ***************************************************
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 1/14/12, Shawn Alan <photophlow at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>> MikeG & Listers
>>>>
>>>> MikeG
>>>> you said
>>>>
>>>> "I probably should have clarified - the 21st century. So basically the
>>>> last
>>>> ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall (pun intended) in the last
>>>> 12 years that
>>>> is more important (overall) than this Martian. In
>>>> terms of scientific value,
>>>> Tagish Lake is probably high on the list of
>>>> the most important in the 21st
>>>> century."
>>>>
>>>> I would have to agree on Tagish Lake its very important and I would say more
>>>> important then TATA in regards of scientists have no clue which parent body
>>>> it came from, and the presolar grains it has and the large amount of
>>>> nanodiamonds found within the meteorite. With the TATA meteorite, this makes
>>>> about 79 classified meteorite from Mars. In ratio to parent body, thats alot
>>>> of meteorite from one location in space considered science has no clue where
>>>> Tagish Lakes parent body is. So in repect to science, TATA is just another
>>>> Mars meteorite, another one to add to the growing list of Martianites :)
>>>>
>>>> On the other hand, ALMAHATA SITTA is by far the most signficate fall in the
>>>> last 12 years
>>>>
>>>> Shawn Alan
>>>> IMCA 1633
>>>> eBay Store
>>>> http://www.ebay.com/sch/ph0t0phl0w/m.html?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of
>>>> this century?
>>>> Galactic Stone & Ironworks meteoritemike
>>>> at gmail.com
>>>> Thu Jan 12 21:23:07 EST 2012
>>>> ? ?* Previous message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit
>>>> Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century?
>>>> ? ?* Next message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian
>>>> Fall. The most significant fall of this century?
>>>> ? ?* Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject
>>>> ] [ author ]
>>>> ________________________________
>>>>
>>>> Hi Count and List,
>>>>
>>>> I probably should have clarified -
>>>> the 21st century. So basically the
>>>> last ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall
>>>> (pun intended) in the last
>>>> 12 years that is more important (overall) than
>>>> this Martian. In
>>>> terms of scientific value, Tagish Lake is probably high on
>>>> the list of
>>>> the most important in the 21st century.
>>>>
>>>> If NonCom
>>>> approves it as a fall and if a lot of good research comes
>>>> out of this
>>>> meteorite, then it's
>>>> surely one of the most interesting
>>>> falls of the 50
>>>> years.
>>>>
>>>> Let's all cross our fingers and hope that MetSoc approves this as
>>>> a
>>>> named fall and that they approve it quickly once they have the data
>>>> required to do so. :)
>>>>
>>>> Best regards,
>>>>
>>>> MikeG
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> *************************************************
>>>>
>>>> Galactic Stone
>>>> & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
>>>>
>>>> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
>>>> Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my
>>>> News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
>>>> Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
>>>>
>>>> ***************************************************
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 1/12/12,
>>>> Count Deiro <countdeiro at
>>>> earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I only know that there are papers published making the
>>>> argument that certain
>>>>
>>>>> SNC's and Alan Hills 84001 show
>>>> evidence of fossilized life forms. There are
>>>>
>>>>> other
>>>> scientists who dispute this. Nakhla has the more compelling artifacts
>>>>
>>>>> and is used more often to prove the hypothesis.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Count Deiro
>>>>
>>>>> IMCA 3536
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> -----Original
>>>> Message-----
>>>>
>>>>>> From: dorifry <dorifry at
>>>> embarqmail.com>
>>>>
>>>>>> Sent: Jan 12, 2012 2:15 PM
>>>>
>>>>>> To: Count Deiro <countdeiro at
>>>> earthlink.net>, Galactic Stone & Ironworks
>>>>
>>>>>> <meteoritemike at
>>>> gmail.com>, meteorite-list at
>>>> meteoritecentral.com
>>>>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list]
>>>> Tata-Foumzgit Martian
>>>> Fall. The most
>>>>
>>>>>> significant fall of
>>>> this century?
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> If life has been
>>>> confirmed on Mars, wouldn't the President have called a
>>>>
>>>>>> press conference?
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> Phil Whitmer
>>>>
>>>>>> Joshua Tree Earth
>>>> & Space Museum
>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>
>>>>>> From: "Count Deiro" <countdeiro at
>>>> earthlink.net>
>>>>
>>>>>> To: "Galactic Stone &
>>>> Ironworks" <meteoritemike at
>>>> gmail.com>;
>>>>
>>>>>> <meteorite-list at
>>>> meteoritecentral.com>
>>>>
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 12,
>>>> 2012 4:41 PM
>>>>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit
>>>> Martian Fall. The most
>>>>
>>>>>> significant fall of this century?
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> Michael has asked:
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Would it be safe to say, that the new Martian
>>>> "Tata" fall is the most
>>>>
>>>>>>>> significant meteorite
>>>> fall of the 21st century, and perhaps of the
>>>>
>>>>>>>> last
>>>> 50+ years?
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> Not even
>>>> close, Mike if by century, you were referring to falls observed
>>>>
>>>>>>> through the 1900's. Take Nakhla for example.
>>>> Witnessed fall. Immediate
>>>>
>>>>>>> collection by experts and
>>>> responsible for stirring the fuel under that
>>>>
>>>>>>> most
>>>> famous of all Martian arguments....is there is, or is there was
>>>>
>>>>>>> ..life on Mars. Chock full of fossilized
>>>> nanobacteria, biomorphs and
>>>>
>>>>>>> whatever else they found
>>>> last month that is being written up at this
>>>>
>>>>>>> writing.
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> Count Deiro
>>>>
>>>>>>> IMCA 3536
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original
>>>> Message-----
>>>>
>>>>>>>> From: Galactic Stone & Ironworks
>>>> <meteoritemike at
>>>> gmail.com>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Jan 12, 2012 9:09 AM
>>>>
>>>>>>>> To: meteorite-list at
>>>> meteoritecentral.com
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Subject:
>>>> [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most
>>>>
>>>>>>>> significant
>>>>
>>>>>>>> fall
>>>> of this century?
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi List,
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Would it be safe to say, that the new Martian
>>>> "Tata" fall is the most
>>>>
>>>>>>>> significant meteorite
>>>> fall of the 21st century, and perhaps of the
>>>>
>>>>>>>> last
>>>> 50+ years?
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> All
>>>> things considered, this has the makings of a very significant
>>>>
>>>>>>>> event for
>>>> science. This is the most pristine
>>>> sample of Mars to arrive
>>>>
>>>>>>>> in labs for a long time,
>>>> if ever. Even the freshest NWA finds cannot
>>>>
>>>>>>>> compare to fresh stones collected less than a
>>>> year after the fall.
>>>>
>>>>>>>> The unbroken stones and
>>>> larger fragments will supply science with
>>>>
>>>>>>>> unaltered, unoxidixed material for research. This
>>>> new Martian is
>>>>
>>>>>>>> going to be widely studied, so I
>>>> hope everyone is getting their
>>>>
>>>>>>>> microprobes warmed
>>>> up in anticipation.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Word has it that institutions and museums have
>>>> been allocated a
>>>>
>>>>>>>> sizeable amount of material in
>>>> terms of trades and donations, so there
>>>>
>>>>>>>> appears
>>>> to be plenty of it available for study. It is safe to say
>>>>
>>>>>>>> that this new meteorite
>>>> (whatever the official
>>>> name turns out to be)
>>>>
>>>>>>>> will appear in a lot of
>>>> papers and journals over time.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> For science, this is the next best thing to a
>>>> manned sample-return
>>>>
>>>>>>>> mission. For collectors this
>>>> is best thing since sliced bread. The
>>>>
>>>>>>>> only thing
>>>> that could have made this fall better, from a collector's
>>>>
>>>>>>>> standpoint, is if a stone had bounced off a
>>>> Bedouin tent and struck a
>>>>
>>>>>>>> camel in the hump. But,
>>>> you can't have your cake and eat it too. ;)
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> So, what is the going consensus on the details of
>>>> this fall?
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Nickname - Tata or Foumzgit (mostly "Tata")
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> TKW - several
>>>> kilograms, probably less than 10kg. Much of this is in
>>>>
>>>>>>>> the form of large whole stones and large broken
>>>> stones and that
>>>>
>>>>>>>> material has been absorbed into
>>>> collections and is not likely to
>>>>
>>>>>>>> return to the
>>>> market. Ballpark figure of material to be available
>>>>
>>>>>>>> eventually on the collector market is probably "a
>>>> few kilos" (2-3kg?)
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Date of fall - July of 2011 (certain), actual
>>>> date - July 25, 2011?
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Other reports say earlier
>>>> in July (13-15?)
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Time of fall - day or night? (night?)
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Type -
>>>> Shergottite, shocked, silver-grey matrix with black shock
>>>>
>>>>>>>> veins. Glossy fresh black fusion crust.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Misc - witness
>>>> reports include an audible explosion and popping sounds.
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Does all of that
>>>> sound about right?
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> *************************************************
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Galactic Stone
>>>> & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my
>>>>
>>>>>>>> News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>> ***************************************************
>>>>
>>>>>>>> ______________________________________________
>>>>
>>>>>>>> HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!
>>>>
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>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> ______________________________________________
>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ________________________________
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ? ?* Previous message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit
>>>> Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century?
>>>> ? ?* Next message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian
>>>> Fall. The most significant fall of this century?
>>>> ? ?* Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject
>>>> ] [ author ]
>>>> ________________________________
>>>>
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>
> Gary Fujihara
> Big Kahuna Meteorites (IMCA#1693)
> 105 Puhili Place, Hilo, Hawai'i 96720
> http://bigkahuna-meteorites.com/
> http://shop.ebay.com/fujmon/m.html
> (808) 640-9161
>
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Received on Mon 16 Jan 2012 05:29:53 AM PST