[meteorite-list] Meteorite Escrow Service

From: Galactic Stone & Ironworks <meteoritemike_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2011 21:35:45 -0500
Message-ID: <CAKBPJW8uBZL1YEma40PxaLE8A6OBKx1ScBxkqr=OkiqX12-C2w_at_mail.gmail.com>

Hi Abe, Gents, Ladies,

Although it's been discussed a hundred times in the past, it bears
repeating in this case just to refresh some memories and educate some
of the newer or less active members of the List.

When in doubt about a meteorite offered to you, consult with the Met List. :)

If you are a member of the IMCA, then all the better - you can ask
their email List and get good answers about the legitimacy of an
offer, a seller, or a specimen.

But, if you are not an IMCA member, or you are a newbie, or you just
don't have expertise in a certain area, then it never hurts to consult
this same List you are currently reading.

This List contains over a thousand (is that right now?) members from
all walks of life, from all backgrounds, and all four corners of the
world. Many are not prolific posters and may not be regular
contributors to this List. But there are many scientists, veteran
dealers, experienced hunters, knowledgeable collectors, and museum
curators on this List - current and retired. There is no question
about a meteorite that this List cannot answer with good authority -
as a collective entity. You also have IMCA members, non-IMCA members,
professional dealers and amateur dealers on this List - many of which
are very familiar with all aspects of the meteorite market for buyers.
 All of us are familiar with each other. There may be feuds and the
occasional slap-fight or drama, but all in all, you can expect a good
pool of answers to choose from. Consider us all a "jury" of sorts.

Newbies and or people who have just joined this List, will discover
that their email address is now busy with new inquiries and all types
of offers. Some sellers might have names unknown to the offer
recipient, but chances are someone on this List will know of the
seller and have some opinion about the reliability and reputation of
the seller. So if you get an email about meteorites and the sender is
unknown to you, consider the following :

1) meteorites are becoming more widely known, so scammers are crawling
out of the wood works to take advantage of this because meteorites
have financial value.

2) you will also get legitimate offers from honest sellers you have
never heard of. you may get offers from Moroccans, Europeans,
Americans, Australians, Japan, China, or elsewhere. there may be a
language barrier involved and it is easy to misinterpret things when
communicating via email using second languages.

3) you will also get offers or questions from well-meaning but
clueless people who have grandpa's old rock and want to sell it
because they *know* it is a meteorite because grandpa saw it fall that
night back in '48. Or you will get questions from people wanting you
to identify their rock and they will send you 20 attached photos that
are all blurry, dark, and show a lump of magnetite, welding slag,
river rock, rusted shovel head, or toliet plunger.

4) There are a 1000+ (give or take) members of this List. A small
handful are lurkers with ill intents, dealers who have fallen from
grace/joined the dark side, or people who are self-appointed experts
with prolific opinions and scant facts. You may get contacted
"off-list" by some of these people and you get offered some "great
deals" on so-so meteorite or a shipment of meteorites from overseas
(lets go in together on this lot), or whatever. When in doubt, go
ahead and ask the Met List.

Lastly, it always go without saying (so I will say it) - if it sounds
too good, then it's probably not true. If red flags goes up, your gut
instinct is usually not far off the truth. But go ahead and ask the
List.

Best regards,

MikeG

-- 
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
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On 11/13/11, Guenther <abe.guenther at mnsi.net> wrote:
> I appreciate the invaluable advice as always.
>
> It makes total sense now why an escrow service may not work in this
> business: The extra shipping cost and the compensation that the escrow
> service would need to charge may add up to the extra cost that would make a
> good deal not such a good deal after all.
>
> The best would be that you could just trust people to ship after they are
> paid but that isn't always going to be the case when buying from an unknown
> seller.
>
> In the most recent solicitations it was from 2 separate individuals wanting
> to sell me NWA meteorites. They went by the names Abdelfattah Gharrad from
> Morocco and Abdellah Afiniss. Maybe they contact people who seem to either
> be new to the business but it would be nice to know if I am the only one
> that was contacted. I like to think that their offer is honest but I have
> never contacted anyone back. I think that it's just too risky unless as you
> say it's for a low enough price that is worth risking.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Abe Guenther
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Count Deiro [mailto:countdeiro at earthlink.net]
> Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2011 5:16 PM
> To: Guenther; meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Escrow Service
>
> Hi Abe,
>
> The List is open to dealers, collectors, hunters, institutions, academics
> and anyone else with an interest in things meteoritical.
> It allows advertising and indeed...the announcement of a sale by any of
> those accessing the List is not an unusual daily occurance and is generally
> welcomed by all. I wouldn't be too upset with having a seller be smart
> enough to see your name and make an unsolicited offer. You can always tell
> that person to stop if they become an annoyance.
>
> There is a restriction as to the frequency of a seller's ad being posted.
> Once a week. Even if a reader isn't interested in buying, the posting of a
> sale provides valuable information about the availability and value of
> meteorites and related items.
>
> I think it appropriate for me to reccommend that you consider purchasing
> from sellers that are current Members of IMCA, as it is a rare bird indeed
> that would cheat you whilst belonging to this group. These IMCA Members have
> a Code of Ethics that they subscribe to follow that deals exactly with your
> fears.
>
> Trying to establish some form of escrow service is not plausible due to the
> lack of individuals with the experience and motivation necessary and the
> cost not only in money, but time. The escrow holder would have to be bonded
> and compensated. It wouldn't pencil out if your dealing with specimens under
> a $1,000.00. If one were considering a large expenditure with an unknown
> seller, I would pay the few hundred bucks to fly to where the goods were and
> see for myself, or buy following these remedies for avoiding being
> "screwed". Have the specimen shipped to you on approval... let the seller
> risks his inventory. Pay by credit card so a dispute would be settled for
> zip by the credit card company investigators.
>
> Finally, let me say that I have bought hundreds of meteorites on just the
> past few years building my cabinet, some valued well up to nearly five
> figures, and I have nothing but good things to say about all the sellers and
> traders I have dealt with. Almost all were introduced to me through the
> List.
>
> Welcome to the ranks, my friend.
>
> Count Deiro
> IMCA 3536
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Guenther <abe.guenther at mnsi.net>
>>Sent: Nov 13, 2011 10:06 AM
>>To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>>Subject: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Escrow Service
>>
>>I don't post a lot but as soon as I do, I get solicitations from people
>>trying to sell me meteorites. So I am assuming it's because of loiterers in
>>the forum. From the names I can tell that they are not from the list. I can
>>only assume that they are either normal people who have a meteorite they
>>would like to sell for some quick cash or it's a scam. If it was the former
>>rather than the latter I would imagine that there could be some pretty good
>>deals out there but I would never want to risk it. If someone actually had
>> a
>>meteorite to sell but had no eBay rating, I understand their motivation to
>>loiter in a forum even though I don't like it. I am sure that there are
>> many
>>honest people who have meteorites they would like to sell but the risk is
>>too high to get scammed.
>>
>>Is there a trustworthy escrow service in the industry? If someone genuinely
>>had a nice stone to sell, whether they contacted me through my forum posts
>>or otherwise, I could direct them to an escrow. An escrow service would
>> help
>>unknown sellers get their meteorites into the hands of collectors without
>>having to build a name for themselves first or have to go to a meteorite
>>convention to sell them. There are many knowledgeable meteorite hunters and
>>collectors in the forum who could quite easily operate an escrow service
>>that people like me would trust.
>>
>>Thanks,
>>
>>Abe Guenther
>>
>>
>>
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>
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Received on Sun 13 Nov 2011 09:35:45 PM PST