[meteorite-list] NWA's, Pairings, Shopping the Block - (was - Ad :Special: Truly baffling & sensational Howardite - NWA 6709 - absolutely stunning and very fresh)

From: Martin Altmann <altmann_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Thu, 21 Jul 2011 03:19:24 +0200
Message-ID: <020601cc4744$3a3323c0$ae996b40$_at_de>

Hi Mike,

only a short remark, note that we have that pairing situation to a more
excessive extent with the Antarctic meteorites and their field number
system.
There aren't 37,000 different finds, but rather 7,000.

Huh, just recently I checked the Antarctic CM2s, cause we're selling a fresh
new one at the moment..
And it's a remarkably salad, where each paired sub-gram sample got its own
number and entry (and classification?) - against that, the NWA-situation is
still quite harmless.

I suppose, that with the always raising prices in Morocco, we will see a
growing atomization of the finds there and more and more paired numbers with
shrinking tkws each.

Best!
Martin



-----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Galactic
Stone & Ironworks
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 21. Juli 2011 02:48
An: Martin Altmann
Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
Betreff: [meteorite-list] NWA's, Pairings, Shopping the Block - (was - Ad
:Special: Truly baffling & sensational Howardite - NWA 6709 - absolutely
stunning and very fresh)

Hi List, Martin, and Edwin,

I was going to make this comment in the recent thread that Martin A.
started about his exquisite new howardite, and then Edwin T. replied
about his apparent pairing of the same meteorite. I didn't want to
risk side-tracking (hijacking) that thread, so here it is in
stand-alone fashion...

The internet and social networking has increased the number of outlets
that Moroccan dealers have to shop the finds they receive from the
nomads. We see a lot of "shopping it around the block" - where
several dealers are approached with an offer that is implied or said
to be exclusive. Dealer A purchases the material and then begins the
process of having it classified, and then cutting it (and polishing)
for resale. Dealer A receives an NWAxxxx number and a new official
meteorite is born into the catalogues.

Lo and behold, weeks or months later, Dealer B across the country has
a very similar looking meteorite of the same type that also has it's
own NWAxxxx number.

And then days later, Dealer C hits the market somewhere on the other
side of the planet with another identical meteorite with a different
NWAxxxx number.

This has always gone on, even in the beginnings, but we are seeing it
more often now or we are getting better at spotting it.

Recent example -

NWA 6288 - Eucrite - TKW 293g - John H. (Irving)

NWA 6386 - Diogenite - TKW 226g - Gary F. (Pickard)

NWA 6293 - Diogenite - TKW 575g - Peter M. (Irving)

All of these are the same meteorite, 3 classifications, 2 classes, 3
different NWA numbers.

The TKW of this combined group of pairings is 1094g - still pretty
small when you consider that 3 different type specimens are off the
market (21g, 23.4g, 20g?).

Now this is one arbitrary example (one I have mentioned previously),
but it is easy to imagine how many such meteorites are currently in
the NWA catalogue. I pity the poor soul who gets tasked with combing
through the mountain of NWA meteorites looking for all known pairings.
 And that is one small area (of several) where the amateur collector
can help advance the understanding of meteoritics. Instead of a
handful of researchers receiving samples, we have hundreds
(thousands?) of hands receiving samples. Some of those amateur hands
have careful and experienced eyes, so perhaps the NWA catalogue can
begin to sort itself out (so to speak), if the collective eyes and
hands of the leagues of laymen put their minds to it.

If and when a time ever comes to put together an authoritative and
exhaustive listing of all known pairings in the NWA catalogue, asking
this mailing list would be a good place to start.

Back to the practice of "shopping the block" ....

Some of the Moroccan dealers are not the only ones shopping the block
- they are being shopped by some of the savvier nomads who may be
presenting the same find to multiple wholesale dealers, also with the
same implied or stated offer of exclusivity. Those who are doing the
shopping know that they stand to make more money from certain
meteorites if they sell smaller lots to multiple buyers instead of one
big lot to a single buyer - one of the Ferengi rules of acquisition I
think. ;)

Other recent examples come to mind. The Hupe's NWA 5400 hit the
market and shortly afterwards at least two possible pairings emerged.

So, who wants to volunteer to round-up all of the pairings and put
them in one list? LOL

Best regards,

MikeG

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----
Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)

Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my
News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----


On 7/20/11, Martin Altmann <altmann at meteorite-martin.de> wrote:
> Hi Mike,
>
> no worries, neither we understood it like that.
>
> Of course, if one looks to the photos, the first idea, which comes to
one's
> mind is: oil.
> No idea, what causes this effect, maybe the composition. Also that strange
> tint the cut faces reveal.
>
> And especially worrying is the variety of the odd inclusions. I mean
> normally we all get already excited, whenever we find a carbonaceous
> fragment in a howardite,
> but what that stone has all for strange clasts - that is really not normal
> anymore.
>
> Since 1999 Stefan is in Morocco and since then we certainly had quite a
> bunch of materials in our hands,
> but such a weird polymict one - extremely unusual.
>
> And it seems that many collectors feel the same, if after such a short
time
> now only three slices are left.
>
> Now all of the smaller ones are gone, sorry for that. But we have still a
> slice left, which we could subdivide into small partslices, if desired -
but
> for that one has really to raise his finger.
>
> For the moment!
> Martin
>
> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
> [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von
Galactic
> Stone & Ironworks
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 21. Juli 2011 00:48
> An: Chladnis Heirs
> Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] AD: Special: Truly baffling & sensational
> Howardite - NWA 6709 - absolutely stunning and very fresh.
>
> Hi Martin,
>
> I didn't mean to impeach the meteorite, I was just curious.
>
> This is indeed a mystery. Have any scientists offered or agreed to
> look at it? Perhaps hit the rainbow area with the microprobe or SEM?
>
> Aesthetically speaking, it's gorgeous and looks like Mother of Pearl. :)
>
> Best regards,
>
> MikeG
>
> --
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -----
> Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
>
> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
> Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my
> News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
> Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
> EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> On 7/20/11, Chladnis Heirs <news at chladnis-heirs.com> wrote:
>> No, it's natural!
>>
>> Martin
>>
>>
>> -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
>> Von: Galactic Stone & Ironworks [mailto:meteoritemike at gmail.com]
>> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 20. Juli 2011 23:24
>> An: Chladnis Heirs
>> Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>> Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] AD: Special: Truly baffling & sensational
>> Howardite - NWA 6709 - absolutely stunning and very fresh.
>>
>> Wow! That is one of the most beautiful howardites I have ever seen.
>> Nice find. :)
>>
>> The rainbox coloration is very odd. Was the stone cleaned at any time?
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> MikeG
>>
>>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -----
>> Galactic Stone & Ironworks - Meteorites & Amber (Michael Gilmer)
>>
>> Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com
>> Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my
>> News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516
>> Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
>> EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564
>>
>
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> -----
>>
>> On 7/20/11, Chladnis Heirs <news at chladnis-heirs.com> wrote:
>>> Dear meteorite community,
>>>
>>> with this Special we have to introduce to you an enormous oddity.
>>> It is about a HED-meteorite of a kind, which we hadn't ever seen before
> in
>>> our careers before.
>>>
>>> It came in two stones, one of them was covered with a lush fusion crust,
>>> wonderfully structured by thick and oriented flowlines.
>>> And in some parts, that very crust displayed a gloss and a shine,
>> iridescent
>>> in all colours of the rainbow;
>>> an effect, reminding almost to bismuth!
>>>
>>> Please take a look to the photos, where we tried to captured the effect:
>>> http://www.chladnis-heirs.com/new-meteorites/nwa6709.html
>>>
>>>
>>> The interior was no less a riddle for us.
>>> The distribution and sizes of the various fragments and clasts were
> unlike
>>> we had seen in any polymict HED before.
>>> A variety of clasts is of a kind, like we never had recovered in any
> Vesta
>>> meteorite. Please take a closer look to the slices and you will share
our
>>> surprise.
>>>
>>> And a very few of these clasts develope due to their microscopically
>>> lamellae-texture a fire like an opal, if turned around in the light.
>>> The response to a magnet is very inhomogeneous within the slices,
>>> although no differences are visible to the eye
>>> and all in all the interior has a somewhat dull yellowish tint -
although
>>> the material is very fresh - and that tint and the circumstances made us
>>> initially think, it might be diogenitic.
>>>
>>> It is under classification at Dr. Anthony Irving and the values say,
that
>> it
>>> is a shocked howardite.
>>>
>>> We crafted now a set of polished sliced of all sizes, to share this
>>> exceptional material with you.
>>> Please acknowledge that we have kept the price, despite of the for us so
>>> unique properties of the material, well affordable,
>>> for everybody staying able to add a specimen of this truly exceptional
>> stone
>>> to his collection.
>>> And an addition it is, also for the most experienced veteran collector.
>>>
>>> Earlier today we had published the Special in the German forum,
therefore
>>> not so many specimens are left.
>>>
>>> For the largest slice we can offer a discount as it is the only one,
> which
>>> isn't coplanar.
>>>
>>> And finally, the specimen named "piece #2", which we chose to illustrate
>>> best that rainbow-bismuth-gloss of the fusion crust on the first linked
>>> page, is available too. It weighs 119.2g and we're accepting offers.
>>>
>>> Here you are now:
>>> http://www.chladnis-heirs.com/specials/special-nwa6709.html
>>>
>>>
>>> Best Regards,
>>> Stefan & Martin
>>>
>>> Chladni's Heirs
>>> Munich - Berlin
>>> Fine Meteorites for Science & Collectors
>>>
>>> http://www.chladnis-heirs.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________
>>> Visit the Archives at
>>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
>>> Meteorite-list mailing list
>>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> ______________________________________________
>> Visit the Archives at
>> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
>> Meteorite-list mailing list
>> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
>> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>>
> ______________________________________________
> Visit the Archives at
> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>
> ______________________________________________
> Visit the Archives at
> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>

--
______________________________________________
Visit the Archives at
http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html
Meteorite-list mailing list
Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list

Received on Wed 20 Jul 2011 09:19:24 PM PDT