[meteorite-list] How to compute NEXRAD radar hit times

From: Jim Wooddell <nf114ec_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 15:57:08 -0700
Message-ID: <197151FC3CCC4C2691AEAF0474CA8268_at_Grande>

Hi Rob,

I understand where you are going. However, let me explain a little further.

I used your example pictures of the fall for my testing. Your pictures show
an exact time over on the top right. The time that you input, exactly, I
can not come up with.
In other words, the data I have available to me via the NOAA archive, does
not have that time. I can not specifically input an exact time down to
seconds. There is no option for that in the software that I am aware of.
An example is the time of (just an example) might be 0302Z and I need
030223Z, 23 seconds later. I can not duplicate the time on your pictures.
Does that make sense??? This is using the Weather and Data tool kit, both
the stable and beta versions and right now V2.5. I was using the NCDS HAS
files. I order the data, they build it and email me when it's ready.
For an example, I order the NEXRAD data. It asks me the Zulu date. Then it
asks what data I want and I select that and click on create graph. I enter
my email address and then enter the beginning time and ending time. I can
only input HR:MM I can not choose seconds. I then submit. When I receive
the notice the order is ready I download it and then have to select the
times in HR:MM that I want. And those are the only choices I have. I can
make a movie of all the individual files but they are not specific to the
exact time I need. So what do you think I am doing wrong?

Your help is very much appreciated.

Jim






From: "Rob Matson" <mojave_meteorites at cox.net>
To: "Jim Wooddell" <nf114ec at npgcable.com>;
<meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2011 3:15 PM
Subject: How to compute NEXRAD radar hit times


> Hi Jim,
>
>> I find the use of Doppler Radar very interesting. I downloaded all
>> the NOAA free stuff I could find to view Doppler from my laptop
>> using their archived data. However, I can not produce the times
>> that are specific to seeing Ash Creek. I was going to use Ash
>> Creek as my test to determine if I was doing things right. I am
>> not! And, I contacted the Phoenix NWS and they can not help with
>> the times. The issue is the time. Only certain specific times are
>> archived, so how or where did the data come from for the specific
>> time?
>
> You probably DO have the right data -- it's just that you have to
> do a bit of extra work to compute the approximate times corresponding
> to a particular radar sweep and target location. Strangely, there is
> NO information on the web about how to do this -- likely because
> meteorologists don't care very much about knowing the scan times
> of a particular cloud front.
>
> Here is how I do it. Mind you, I have no confirmation that my
> technique is correct, but it is mathematically sensible and is
> based on some logical assumtions:
>
> 1. The NEXRAD radar sweep rate (in azimuth) is constant.
> 2. The sweep direction is clockwise as viewed from above.
> 3. Each elevation scan takes the same amount of time to
> complete.
> 4. Each full scan starts at the lowest cut angle and ends
> at the highest cut angle, with transitions in cut angle
> occurring when the radar is transmitting due north.
> 5. That the time-tag of each file corresponds to the start
> time of the lowest cut angle, and that at that time the
> radar is pointing due north.
>
> (I would love to have some confirmation that all of these
> assumptions are correct -- Marc Fries can likely confirm or
> correct me.)
>
> One remaining uncertainty I have is what physically happens
> with the radar when it generates two sweeps at the same cut
> angle (e.g. 0.5-degrees and 1.5-degrees are nearly always
> swept twice each.) In these cases, does the radar complete
> two full revolutions for each cut angle, or are the double
> sweeps really just a single sweep, but processed twice (in
> software) at different sensitivities? I have a feeling it's
> the latter, since I usually see very little movement in
> scene features between scans at the same cut angle.
>
> In either case, what you need to do is count up how many
> sweeps are done for each full scan -- it's usually at
> least 5, and can be quite a bit more when in storm mode.
> Divide the time between consecutive full scans (typically
> around 10 minutes) by the number of sweeps per scan.
>
> Example:
>
> Image #1 timetag: 02:12:06
> Image #2 timetag: 02:21:56
> 5 sweeps per full scan
>
> (2:21:56 - 2:12:06) = 09:50
> 09:50 / 5 = 1 minute 58 seconds (1.967 minutes)
>
> This tells you that the radar sweep rate is:
>
> 360 degrees / 1.967 minutes = 183.1 degrees/minute, or
> 3.051 degrees/second.
>
> Now, to determine the time of a specific radar "hit", all
> you need is its azimuth (i.e. bearing from the radar),
> which is displayed at the bottom of the Toolkit screen
> when your cursor is over the hit.
>
> Let's say you see your target in the second sweep out of
> five (e.g. the 1.5-degree cut angle) and that it's at
> azimuth 227 degrees. Using the above example, the time of
> that hit is computed as follows:
>
> 02:12:06 + (1 sweep * 1.967 minutes) + (227/360 * 1.967 min)
> = 02:12:06 + 1.967 minutes + 1.240 minutes
> = 02:15:12
>
> Try this with Ash Creek, and I think you should come very
> close to the time that Marc Fries did.
>
> Good luck!
> Rob
>
Received on Sun 23 Jan 2011 05:57:08 PM PST