[meteorite-list] Why Are Death Valley's Rocks Moving Themselves? -- not off-topic at all!

From: Adam Hupe <raremeteorites_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2011 12:44:47 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <673707.35453.qm_at_web30704.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

There is no doubt whatsoever that wind plays a major part in it. I observed a
large rock and a piece of galvanized sheet metal side by side about ten years
ago. I recently observed the same rock and piece of metal but this time they
were separated by about 50 feet. The trail of the rock went straight but the
metal acting like a keel or rudder moved off in another direction. It is obvious
that the metal acted like sail since its trail was much longer. You could tell
the difference between true and apparent wind direction was about 12%.


Best Regards,

Adam





----- Original Message ----
From: Larry Atkins <thetoprok at aol.com>
To: mojave_meteorites at cox.net; mpg4444 at gmail.com;
meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Sat, February 19, 2011 12:30:24 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Why Are Death Valley's Rocks Moving Themselves? --
not off-topic at all!

Michael, Rob, List

I encountered these rock trails on Red Dry Lake last year. Some were a hundred
feet long or more! I saw two trails side by side that made a 10 degree turn at
the same time, indicating to me a shift of wind and ice float direction.

>From article below:
"Movement happens for only tens of seconds, at intervals spaced
typically by several years," said Lorenz


I'm not sure this scenario makes sense. Why couldn't the ice float move 10's of
feet or more at a time? I think the trails I saw, described above, contradict
this theory.


Sincerely,
Larry Atkins
 
IMCA # 1941
Ebay alienrockfarm
 


-----Original Message-----
From: Rob Matson <mojave_meteorites at cox.net>
To: Michael Groetz <mpg4444 at gmail.com>; Meteorite List
<meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Sat, Feb 19, 2011 3:06 pm
Subject: [meteorite-list] Why Are Death Valley's Rocks Moving Themselves? -- not
off-topic at all!


Hi Michael,

IMHO, it's definitely ice-rafting. It happens on any desert playa that
is hard enough, receives sufficient winter rains, and gets cold enough
to freeze at night. In California, I've seen the rock furrows at Silver
Dry Lake, Superior Dry Lake, Cuddeback Dry Lake and (most recently)
Coyote Dry Lake. I've also seen them on some Nevada playas as well
as the Alvord Desert in Oregon, and they occur in Arizona, as well.

SoCal got a lot of rain this past December -- so much so that even
after three weeks of dry weather in January the northern third of
Coyote was under water. I've never seen this in the decade I've been
going there, and sure enough I saw rock trails there for the first
time last month.

Bob Verish, Nick Gessler and I coauthored an abstract and presentation
on this subject, and in particular its implications for meteorite
recovery, at the 65th Annual Meeting of the Meteoritical Society
in 2002:

http://adsabs.harvard.edu/full/2002M%26PSA..37Q..51G

Cheers,
Rob


-----Original Message-----
From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com]On Behalf Of Michael
Groetz
Sent: Friday, February 18, 2011 5:24 PM
To: Meteorite List
Subject: [meteorite-list] OT (Sorta...) Why Are Death Valley's Rocks
MovingThemselves?


  Interesting photo- wish I could crawl out of my chair in Ohio and
go check those rocks out.
  I know this has been discussed on the list before.
  Have a good night.
Mike

http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2011/02/18/death-valleys-rocks-moving-racetra
ck-playa/

Why Are Death Valley's Rocks Moving Themselves?

By Philip Schewe

Published February 18, 2011 | Inside Science News Service

Death Valley National Park contains many mysteries, including one of
nature's strangest phenomena: rocks that seem to move around all on
their own.

In the remote, almost totally dry lakebed called Racetrack Playa, some
of the rocks move themselves across the desert floor when people
aren't watching.

Scientists know the rocks move because they leave narrow tracks
trailing behind them, but they haven't actually seen it happen. And
although one can't entirely rule out the possibility of some prank
being played, at least some of the rocks appear to be moving under
natural circumstances.

It doesn't rain often in Racetrack Playa, and when it does the lakebed
can flood. The rocks don't float exactly, but the main explanation for
their movement is that moisture can make the mud on which the rocks
sit more slick, making it easier for high winds to push the rocks
along. Another explanation offered is that the temporary deposit of
water, chilled to form extensive sheets of ice, might help to reflect
and focus the winds, making it easier for the rocks to move.

The winds required to move rocks in this way would seem to be at the
level of 100 mph or more. That's why the rocks are sometimes referred
to as "sailing stones." They are rare but they have been noticed in
Racetrack Playa and a few other arid places around the world subject
to occasional floods

Ralph Lorenz, a scientist at Johns Hopkins University, offers a new
explanation. The rocks are actually lifted up by the ice, or at least
made more buoyant by the ice, making it easier for the rocks to
migrate. If the rocks are moving about on ice rafts, the ground below
cannot offer as much resistance against their motion and the winds
needed for movement wouldn't have to be as great, he argued.

So why hasn't the motion been observed?

"Movement happens for only tens of seconds, at intervals spaced
typically by several years," said Lorenz. "This would demand
exceptional patience as well as luck."

So, the rocks are probably traveling on the coldest and windiest days
that occur over a period of several years. The most likely time would
be in the very early dawn. Little wonder no one is around to witness
the event.

Lorenz and his colleagues would like to install inexpensive time-lapse
monitoring of the Playa area, using digital cameras. The lakebed is
about 2.5 miles long and 1.25 miles wide. They have also performed
some laboratory tests by blowing on ice-assisted rocks. These simple
tests support the ice-raft hypothesis. The results appear in the
January 2011 issue of the American Journal of Physics.

An additional reason for studying the rocks of Racetrack Playa is that
its qualities resemble those at a drying-up lake on Saturn's moon
Titan. Pictures taken by the Cassini-Huygens mission reveal what look
like river channels, cobblestones, and lake beds or mud flats. Only at
Titan's "Ontario Lacus," as one interesting site is called, the runoff
consists of liquid hydrocarbons, not water. Some pictures even seem to
be showing a "bathtub ring" left by what is probably a drying lake.

One of Lorenz's colleagues, Brian K. Jackson, who works at NASA's
Goddard Space Flight Center, also likes the idea that their research
at Racetrack Playa has a dual purpose.

"It's been exciting trying to solve a mystery that has resisted
solution for sixty years," Jackson said. "Scientific accounts of the
Racetrack Playa rocks go back to at least 1948, and there were
certainly stories about the playa long before that.

And Jackson also believes discoveries in Death Valley, here on Earth,
will help us to better understand similar real estate on Titan or
Mars.

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Received on Sat 19 Feb 2011 03:44:47 PM PST