[meteorite-list] pairing and collecting

From: Shawn Alan <photophlow_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 21:13:20 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <449305.16821.qm_at_web35406.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Richard and Lister,
?
I think you?and the rest of us on here feel the same way about meteorite collecting, but at the end of the day, some Listers can spend $1000's if not more and?for those?reasons money is an issue. To fork over a few $1000 for an NWA 5400?that has been speculated to be from Earth, which no proven evidence has been put forth can be hardening and to make matters more interesting, there are meteorites coming out of the wood workings of the meteorite world that are being?paired with NWA 5400. All of these factors can affect the value of the meteorite and how much is spent on acquiring it.
?
I see this has?happenen nefore?with meteorites and chatted with some?people that told me they spent some coins and to find out later?that the research didn't become of?anything or that exclusive meteorite, has pairings. Now to?me I?would rethink before I would?buy a meteorite and be certain that the research is done and proven and not just speculated.
?
I find it difficult sometimes that some of the processes used to market meteorites can be over indulged in some ways and the research hasn't been proven yet. So that's way at the end of the day I go withthe ?historic meteorites, they have proven time and time to have?a rich history and legacy, which?I am fond of and enjoy tracing back?the footsteps that theses?meteorites had on the science community.
?
Shawn Alan
IMCA 1633
eBaystore
http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p4340













[meteorite-list] pairing and collectingRichard Montgomery rickmont at earthlink.net
Tue Sep 28 22:48:57 EDT 2010


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David and List...in concert with the current discussion on NWA 5400 and
6292: I want to share with everyone why I even started this passion,
because it goes directly to David's point. It also points to a reminder of
why we do this crazy passion. Essentially, it is knowledge that drives most
of us, at the very least the quest for knowledge....

When the political winds started blowing along about global climate trends,
I decided to investigate for myself. I know/knew that more powerful sources
were impacting our planet, more than aerosol cans.

I wound finding Rocks-From-Space. Eyes open. (My original copy is so
dog-eared and re-re-re-read that I eventually bought a hard-cover with
Richard Norton's blessing and signature....I keep it next to the other
awesome texts of our time!) And, the rest became history, literally.

None in my circle of debating friends had any clue about meteoritic impact
events, let alone "instant impact" events that have changed the static model
of specie emergence and decline....actually off the page and not even known.
The status quo static model for evolving species being the prevailing trend,
I was a lone wolf even bringing this up.

So, I decided to become best-friends with meteorites and all things
meteoritic that I could find. Power is found in things true, every time
it's used. Knowledge drives my passion, not $$ (although, since I have a
pitiful limited supply of it, it does limit my ability to look and see)....

Just a thought for relativity. -Richard Montgomery



This passion we all have in meteorites
----- Original Message -----
From: "David R. Vann" <drvann at sas.upenn.edu>
To: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2010 10:24 AM
Subject: [meteorite-list] pairing and collecting



>

> I'd like to make a couple of observations about both pairing and

> collecting.

>

> Several comments have been made regarding preserving the value of a

> meterorite,

> with reference to pairings decreasing value, etc. I don't know why you

> collect,

> heck, I don't even know why I collect things. It is apparently a part of

> human

> nature (for at least some) . Sure, we rationalize it by saying "it is a

> beautiful thing", "it has an interesting story", etc., but in the final

> analysis, these things are not necessities. Somewhere along the line, I

> think it

> was with baseball cards, the rarity of some items, combined with an

> increasing

> market from an expnading population, drove the price for these items out

> of

> sight. And thus, the concept of "investibles" had its genesis. This is a

> marketing ploy to get you to buy things. However, if you think that

> collectible

> items are an investment with a monetary return, you need to think very,

> very

> carefully about this idea. The vast majority of collectible items will not

> make

> you rich. An example: a friend bought a Saint Gaudens gold coin a while

> back.

> Whereas his stocks declined, he ultimately sold the coin for twice what he

> paid

> - so he thought he made out. The actual rate of return was just about 3

> 1/2

> percent. Guess how much inflation went up during that time? I have watched

> many

> types of collectible investments over the years. Most actually lose money

> after

> you account for inflation. Many of them return the same buying power you

> had

> when they were bought. A few, very few, bring a great return on

> investment.

> Where do meteorites fall? I doubt that you will make much money on them,

> Bob

> Haag nonwithstanding. There is always a point in a new market where there

> is

> money to be made, but after that, not so much. As a dealer, can you make a

> living? Quite possibly, yes - that can be answered by others. Will there

> be a

> return as an investment - I seriously doubt it. No collector should

> collect

> because he or she expects a return on investment - you should collect

> because

> you like the item, like looking at it, like its story/history, or as

> Martin

> said, because you can be involved in some way with the science. In other

> words,

> for the pleasure brought to you by the possession of the object. If you

> make

> money on it, well then, that's a great bonus. But it should never be the

> purpose, as you will be disappointed. I'm sure many on this list can add

> their

> own experiences in this regard. Just remember, next time the speculating

> bankers

> take down the world economy (again...how many times is it now?),

> meteorites will

> have no value - but your can of Spam will.

>

> So, if my meteorite now has a new friend, a pair, am I to despair? Well,

> not

> from the scientific point of view, because that is supporting evidence.

> How

> about from the investment point of view? Does the value decrease because

> we now

> have two stones? Does it? (see above) How about from the point of view of

> the

> collector? Now you can buy two, rather than just one. What are we

> collecting,

> after all? We are collecting names. Yes, names, like Orgueil, Almahatta

> Sitta,

> Weston. If the current understanding is correct, the lithological

> classification

> of a meteorite has something to do with the body(ies) it may have

> originated on,

> and the processes on that planetoid. In other words there is a very good

> likelihood that ALL H5 stones are Paired!!! OMG!!! What does that do to

> the

> value of my Bassikounou? Nothing, actually. Almahatta Sitta is just

> another

> ureilite, after all. But one with the best story of all (from the

> scientific

> point of view). Many, many stones will be paired in the end, because they

> came

> from the same source. Occasionally, they will be "lauch-paired", i.e.

> knocked

> off the source at the same time. After all, if the current ideas are

> correct,

> the entire class of HEDO meteorties were probably launch-paired in a

> colossal

> impact that knocked off a quarter of Vesta. Does having several specimens

> of

> different names (whether Frankfort or Kapoeta or NWA 1929) make any one of

> them

> less valuable? I don't think so. Collecting Frankfort or Kapoeta, you are

> collecting a story (they are falls). Collecting NWA1929, you are

> collecting a

> name, but only the story that it is a Howardite, and likely some part of a

> shattered asteroid. The first two cost more because of their story, not so

> much

> because of their classification. For NWA5400 and NWA6162, we are

> collecting

> stories again. Whether Greg H. charges more than Peter M., or vice versa,

> has to

> do with what they want to get - it is theirs, after all - they can charge

> anything they want. Will I pay it? Well, that depends on whether can

> afford it

> and want a piece of that story (it might be an 'Earthite", in case you

> haven't

> been paying attention).

>

> So, in summary: don't collect because you think you will get rich

> colecting -

> you won't. Don't imagine that pairs affect really affect actual value;

> they

> don't because, in the end everything will have pairs. My fifty dinars

> worth (to

> paraphrase Mike G., actual mileage can and does vary).

>

> OK, that's enough for now, back to analyzing rocks....

>

>

>

>

> David R. Vann, Ph.D.

> Department of Earth and Environmental Science

> THE UNIVERSITY of PENNSYLVANIA

> 240 S. 33rd St.

> Philadelphia, PA 19104-6316

> drvann at sas.upenn.edu

> office: 215-898-4906

> FAX: 215-898-0964

>

> ______________________________________________

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Received on Wed 29 Sep 2010 12:13:20 AM PDT