[meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 !
From: Greg Hupe <gmhupe_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 28 Sep 2010 19:30:14 -0400 Message-ID: <451D1F97DA7E41AB9E430610FAED3E0D_at_greg323a964987> Hello Shawn and List, Shawn wrote: "Greg H you say that O isotope is the only factor to determine pairing... your wrong there are other factors with paring meteorites. Some body told me this........" Yes, I said that oxygen IS needed to determine a pairing to NWA 5400, as was explained to me by the lead scientists. My comments have never been about any other meteorites when referring to the ongoing NWA 5400 pairing saga. Shawn wrote: "...I have a dieing question.... What is the CRE of NWA 5400?" I do not know this answer. Samples of NWA 5400 were shipped to many different labs around the world where scientists are continuing to unlock the secrets of this most unique meteorite. Hope everyone has a great evening, for me, it is time to enjoy a pleasant meal! Best regards, Greg ==================== Greg Hupe The Hupe Collection NaturesVault (eBay) gmhupe at htn.net www.LunarRock.com IMCA 3163 ==================== Click here for my current eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault ----- Original Message ----- From: "Shawn Alan" <photophlow at yahoo.com> To: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com> Cc: <meteoritemike at gmail.com>; <gmhupe at htn.net> Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2010 6:34 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 ! Mike G and Greg H and Listers, Mike G great point about how exclusivity is misconstrued with NWAs and before you know it, you have multiple pairs. Good example, NWA 2999, yeah there is a lot of pairs with that one and some say that the other pairs don't me squat and only buy the real deal. So you see that's where the problem lies with price points and collecting NWA's. I personally from a collectors stand point only collect some NWAs that I deem fit, Lunars and Mars and a couple others, but for the most part, I stay away and let the scientist do their work. But for other meteorites, I go for the historic ones and rare types with real importance, not ones that have multiple meteorite from the same parent body but with slight differences in composition. Greg H you say that O isotope is the only factor to determine pairing... your wrong there are other factors with paring meteorites. Some body told me this........ " O isotopes don't "prove" that one specimen is matched with another. It is certainly possible that two separate but related meteorites will have very similar O-isotopic compositions. They also could have similar olivine Fa compositions, similar refractory lithophile abundances, etc. It is certainly very suggestive of pairing if the textures, compositions (chemical and isotopic), and CRE ages match. But more supportive would be the terrestrial residence ages, i.e., if they fell at around the same time. The best proof of pairing is if the different samples fit together." So you see there are other factors involved with pairing and I have a dieing question.... What is the CRE of NWA 5400? If it came from Earth 4 billion years ago that you suggested, wouldn't the CRE be around 4 billion years? I heard that the oldest CRE to this date for a stoney meteorite is around 100 million years. I find it odd that this hasn't been test when this test is simple compared to other test to prove it might have a connection to Earth. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBaystore http://shop.ebay.com/photophlow/m.html?_nkw=&_armrs=1&_from=&_ipg=&_trksid=p4340 [meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 ! Galactic Stone & Ironworks meteoritemike at gmail.com Tue Sep 28 17:20:58 EDT 2010 Previous message: [meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 ! Next message: [meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 ! Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Greg and List, I wasn't trying to take a shot at anyone. But the marketplace has changed, even in the brief 3 years I have been active on it. There was a time, not long ago, that the number of stateside dealers who bought directly from the Moroccan sources could be counted on two hands - not counting buying from a wholesaler at a show like Tucson. 10 years ago, how many people were wiring money to the Moroccans for Fed-Ex packages full of meteorites that were destined for resale? I would wager that it was not very many compared to now. On Facebook alone, there are no less than 2 dozen overseas and Moroccan dealers who are selling directly to the end collector. These sellers know they can get more money for their stones by selling to a newbie dealer or end collector, than selling to a veteran dealer. I wasn't taking a shot at NWA 5400 or the Hupes. I think that nowadays, any meteorite that is offered to one dealer, is going to be offered to several dealers and collectors - to maximize profit. Our overseas friends are eager students of capitalism and they are simply applying the same lessons they have learned after years of watching their stones get sold for pennies on the dollar and then flipped onto the market of end collectors for a profit. This is happening more and more now. Speaking from personal experience, I have now processed (sliced and polished) a new NWA meteorite from 2 independent Moroccan sources. Guess what? It's the same meteorite and there is a 3rd dealer offering this same material. All 3 meteorites are exactly the same and have 3 different NWA numbers. Of course, I am making a casual pairing based on handling the material and I cannot say for certain they are exactly the same without microprobe and/or O-isotope. But from talking to these dealers, each one had no idea that other dealers were being offered the same material. Each one thought they were getting an exclusive deal. If I am an overseas source, I know I will get more money per gram for my stones if I sell them to a collector on Facebook versus selling them to a seasoned dealer like Adam or Greg. Now that this fact is well known, the genie is out of the bottle. Exclusivity for NWA finds is dead. Best regards, MikeG ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone & Ironworks Meteorites Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone EOM - http://www.encyclopedia-of-meteorites.com/collection.aspx?id=1564 ----------------------------------------------------------------------- On 9/28/10, Greg Hupe <gmhupe at htn.net> wrote: > Hello Eric and All, > > MikeG wrote: > "So, if NWA 5400 turned up in the Hupe inventory, you can bet your bottom > dollar that the same meteorite will show up in other dealer inventories > under a different NWA number(s)." > > MikeG obviously made a hip-shot, knee-jerk uninformed comment. Considering > there are plenty of single stone classifications discovered by > me, Adam and other people throughtout. At least some people are finally > discussing that > in order to make an NWA 5400 pairing, oxygen isotope work MUST be > completed, period!! This has been my argument from Day 1 when "NWA 5363" > was > claimed as a pairing without any oxygen work being performed! > People need to go back and re-read my very first announcement of NWA 5400, > and then my first comments about "NWA 5363". As mentioned in my last email > regarding this thread, I do not feel I need to keep harping on these > facts. > I appreciate a few cool heads making these statements on their own, > refreshing to know a few people still understand the value of patience and > thorough work! > > Best regards, > Greg > > ==================== > Greg Hupe > The Hupe Collection > NaturesVault (eBay) > gmhupe at htn.net > www.LunarRock.com > IMCA 3163 > ==================== > Click here for my current eBay auctions: > http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZnaturesvault > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Meteorites USA" <eric at meteoritesusa.com> > To: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com> > Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 2010 4:15 PM > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 ! > > >> What do you mean, am I reading this right? You assume because 1 person >> has a piece of a rare meteorite that it's an absolute that more of that >> meteorite exists? >> >> This certainly doesn't take into account single meteorite >> classifications at all. Are you saying the EVERY NWA ever classified has >> a pairing? Because that's what this sounds like. >> >> Regards, >> Eric >> >> >> On 9/28/2010 12:36 PM, Galactic Stone & Ironworks wrote: >>> So, if >>> NWA 5400 turned up in the Hupe inventory, you can bet your bottom >>> dollar that the same meteorite will show up in other dealer >>> inventories under a different NWA number(s). >> ______________________________________________ >> Visit the Archives at >> http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.856 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3164 - Release Date: 09/28/10 > 02:34:00 > > ______________________________________________ > Visit the Archives at > http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > -- Previous message: [meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 ! Next message: [meteorite-list] NWA 6292 (BRA) IS paired to NWA 5400 ! Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] More information about the Meteorite-list mailing list -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 9.0.856 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3165 - Release Date: 09/28/10 13:41:00Received on Tue 28 Sep 2010 07:30:14 PM PDT |
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