[meteorite-list] It is a sad day.....

From: Martin Altmann <altmann_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 19:58:47 +0100
Message-ID: <009a01cabfba$8d704d50$07b22959_at_name86d88d87e2>

I agree,

addendum: ..and meteorites can be a cultural heritage, if they are part of a
scientific collection. That was, was the 1970-UNESCO convention said about
mineral objects - and ONLY that.

Archaeology is the science dealing with ancient times and human history.
This kind of science has absolutely nothing to do with meteorites, neither
are meteorites research objects of that science.

Culture is by its widest definition everything what has to do with humans.
 
Meteorites are objects from space, a new find which never had contact with
any humans in its few thousands years it has spent on Earth is no cultural
object at all.

Therefore I don't believe, that if laws which try to declare new meteorite
finds as cultural heritage or antiquities would be challenged, could
withstand in any court.

Let's see. Maybe we will have soon a reference case.
Those people arrested in Sudan for having collected Almahata Sitta were
arrested for having violated laws about archaeological things. At least in
the articles it was said so.
And Almahata Sitta is one of these meteorites, which spent almost no time
yet with us humans.
But on the other hands, Sudan isn't directly a rule of law.....

Best!
Martin

 

-----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht-----
Von: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
[mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Adam
Hupe
Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. M?rz 2010 19:15
An: Adam
Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] It is a sad day.....

Hi Daryl and List,

My concern is that laws that have nothing to do with meteorites are being
twisted to include them with no input from the public whatsoever. To me,
this is not the American way. If they want laws protecting them, gather a
consensus, contact their legislatures, make them and stop twisting old laws.
Then these new laws can be challenged all the way up to supreme court if
necessary so they are not nebulous. I agree with the laws protecting
cultural items but meteorites have nothing to do with this unless they were
worshiped or turned into an artifact. There is very little money involved
with meteorites compared to minerals or fossils so why all of this unwanted
attention?

Best Regards,

Adam


----- Original Message ----
From: Darryl Pitt <darryl at dof3.com>
To: Adam Hupe <raremeteorites at yahoo.com>
Cc: Adam <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Tue, March 9, 2010 10:03:04 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] It is a sad day.....



Many countries have what are referred to loosely as "Antiquity & National
Heritage Acts" and this is modeled after the same. Simply expressed, a
wide net is being cast, and it's not a novel idea for meteorites to be
viewed as part of a nation's heritage.

I hope Jeff Grossman's idea is embraced---which happens to be in the pocket
of the work Svend and others have already embarked upon.


All best / Darryl




On Mar 9, 2010, at 11:34 AM, Adam Hupe wrote:

> I cannot understand how a meteorite can be considered an antique when most
terrestrial rocks could be called the same thing. The only way to get a rock
that is not an antique is to live near a productive volcano where you can
retrieve a freshly created one like in Hawaii. A meteorite has no
scientific importance whatsover if it is left on the ground to weather away,
especially in Oregon and Washington where the climate is very destructive.
>
> Why all of this new interest in meteorites when only a handful have ever
been found in Oregon and Washington? Why are old laws being twisted to
include meteorites? Why waste the time creating an entry on a website
protecting meteorites where very few have been found? It would be
interesting to find out what parties are involved with the twisting of these
laws and admonish them for being stupid. Maybe they were influenced by the
media who overstate the monetary value and understate the scientific
importance of these objects. You treat something like valuable treasure and
the government will do the same. Everybody wants a piece of the pie whether
they have earned it or not. I believe in the finders/keepers concept that
has worked well for centuries. A meteorite is worthless until found!
>
>
> Best Regards,
>
> Adam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Galactic Stone & Ironworks <meteoritemike at gmail.com>
> To: valparint at aol.com
> Cc: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> Sent: Tue, March 9, 2010 6:18:48 AM
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] It is a sad day.....
>
> Hi List,
>
> I think this is a lot of worry and noise over nothing. The only thing
> that has changed with this announcement is a block of text on a
> website.
>
> How a law is worded, versus how it is enforced are two different things.
>
> It's illegal to keep arrowheads you find in Florida, yet almost every
> local down here has some in a drawer or box. My grandfather (a highly
> decorated WWII veteran and all around great person) was quite proud of
> his arrowheads and I'd like to see some LEO try to take them from him.
>
> I don't think this wording change on a website is going to mean much
> in the long run. It just means we are going to hear more
> conversations like this one :
>
> BLM officer : Where did you get that rock that looks like a meteorite?
>
> Met Hunter : Oh that? I brought that with me from home, it's a good
> luck charm. But it's not working today because I didn't find
> anything.
>
> -----------
>
> Or -
>
> Met Buyer : Where did you say you found this meteorite again?
>
> Met Hunter/Seller : I didn't, because I can't remember where I found
> it. It's the funniest thing, because I know I found it, but I don't
> remember where or when. I really need to stop sniffing glue before I
> forget where all of these specimens came from.
>
> -----------------
>
> Don't you just love it when a government that murdered thousands of
> indigenous people and stole this land from the native American
> indians, now tries to dictate about theft and property?
>
> Message from this tax payer - hey government, you can make demands
> about meteorites when you give back the Indians' land you stole. It's
> very hypocritical to claim that meteorite hunters are stealing from
> federal land, when that federal land was stolen by the government from
> it's rightful owners.
>
> I don't take orders from a government that hands out small-pox
> infected blankets to women and children. (or funds the School of the
> Americas)
>
> -------------------
>
> See yall out on the dry lake beds soon. ;)
>
> Best regards,
>
> MikeG
>
>
>
> On 3/9/10, valparint at aol.com <valparint at aol.com> wrote:
>> I'll give up my meteorites when they pry them from my cold, dead fingers.
>>
>> Paul Swartz
>> ______________________________________________
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>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> Mike Gilmer - Galactic Stone & Ironworks Meteorites
> http://www.galactic-stone.com
> http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone
> ------------------------------------------------------------
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Received on Tue 09 Mar 2010 01:58:47 PM PST