[meteorite-list] What makes a hammer a hammer?

From: lebofsky at lpl.arizona.edu <lebofsky_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2009 10:35:50 -0700 (MST)
Message-ID: <53420.71.226.60.25.1231090550.squirrel_at_timber.lpl.arizona.edu>

Dave:

Johnny Carson also is responsible for one other "famous" phrase:

"billions and billions"

not Carl Sagan.

Larry

On Sun, January 4, 2009 9:29 am, Dave Gheesling wrote:
> Michael wrote: "Dave Gheesling was essentially correct in stating that
> The
> "word," "HAMMER" first appeared in a book by Niven and Pournelle,
> entitled, LUCIFER'S HAMMER, Fawcett Crest, 1977.
> (Ironically, in the book, this term is a misnomer, as the Astronomer who
> first views the object and predicts a Huge earth impact was named Hamner,
> and it was a "religious" figure that stated that "Lucifer's Hammer" Was
> going to punish the people of the earth"
>
> Actually, it was sort of an intentional, or perhaps Freudian, misnomer,
> ficticiously coming from Johnny Carson (well known for intentional
> Freudian
> slips). Interviewing the ficticious astronomer, Tim Hamner, Carson said,
> "Tim, it's your comet. Could HAMMER-Brown actually hit us?" Hamner
> responds, "That's HAMNER-Brown." Carson laughs, "Oh, what did I say?
> Hammer? It would be a hammer if it hit, wouldn't it?" Fun read, by the
> way, and the initial conditions are remarkably similar to a real H-B comet
> that would arrive two decades later...
>
> Make it a great Sunday, everybody,
>
>
> Dave
> www.fallingrocks.com
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com
> [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Michael
> L
> Blood
> Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 4:39 AM
> To: Steve Arnold dealer/Qynne; meteoritefinder at yahoo.com
> Cc: Meteorite List
> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] What makes a hammer a hammer?
>
>
> Steve, Robert, Dave, Walter, Mike, John et al,
> Several comments:
> (I would have responded earlier, but I was watching The Chargers KICK
> ASS!)
>
>
> 1) Any information listed on my hammer page
> http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/Hammers.html
> Regarding Sylacauga is more accurately expressed by (THE REAL) Steve
> Arnold.
> I stand corrected by him on All accounts regarding this specific hammer.
>
>
> 2) Walter Branch's original page can be seen at:
> http://imca.repetti.net/metinfo/metstruck.html
> His reference to "HAMs" he states, is a reference to "humans, animals &
> man made objects" and is unrelated To my coining the term, "Hammer" in
> reference to any Fall that resulted in a stone striking one of the above.
>
> 3) Dave Geesling was essentially correct in stating that The "word,"
> "HAMMER" first appeared in a book by Niven and Pournelle, entitled,
> LUCIFER'S HAMMER, Fawcett Crest, 1977.
> (Ironically, in the book, this term is a misnomer, as the Astronomer who
> first views the object and predicts a Huge earth impact was named Hamner,
> and it was a "religious" figure that stated that "Lucifer's Hammer" Was
> going to punish the people of the earth (much like The gobledgook vomited
> by the "religious" that state that AIDS is a punishment by God for the
> "sin" of homosexuality.
> I read this book 10 or more years before I got into meteorites But my use
> of the term "hammer" was, in fact, inspired To a degree from this book.
> However, I thought long and hard About the term I wanted to use before
> deciding to use "hammer." Since I was collecting them and determined to
> offer the largest Selection available of them, I felt a name was
> definitely called For and "hammer" it was.
>
> 4) When one coins a term, that person sets the parameters Of definition.
> Inevitably these parameters will change or Be refined over time. My use of
> the term "Hammer" was In reference to a meteorite that "nailed"
> something - specifically Human, animal or human made, just as was made
> reference to In Walter's work. Personally, I EXCLUDE roads and cultivars
> (varieties of
> hybridized fruit trees), though there are others who collect hammers that
> include them.
>
> 5) The entire fall is a "Hammer" fall and a specific individual that hit
> A
> specific object, animal or person is a "Hammer stone" (very, very Few
> irons)(the use of "hammer stone" was introduced by Adam Hupe. Though I
> originally debated his usage, conversations with him brought Me over to
> his side on this issue). Of course, one would always prefer THE hammer
> stone Of a fall or one of several.... For instance, I have 9 different
> Park Forest "Hammers" that
> include several houses, a car, a tow truck, A fire station, a baseball
> grandstand, fence, etc. However, in many cases The one or few hammer
> stones is not available (the guy in the boat Threw all that landed in his
> boat into the river, as they were clearly "evil"- Chiang-Khan) or the tiny
> Mbale stone that struck a boy.... I Have a
> photo of him holding it but no amount of research has resulted In finding
> ANYONE who can even say they have any idea of what Happened to that
> particular stone. As for Allende, Pultusk, Holbrook, etc, there is written
> documentation describing houses and patios, a train station being struck -
> I
> am working on a book that will cite a good deal of written records
> attesting to such events - the topic is far too extensive to include here.
>
>
> 6) I am amazed at the egocentric attitude of people who look down on
> others Who are "into" something that holds no interest for them. It would
> be like Me stating all NWA material is insignificant, regardless of rarity
> of type Because it is nearly all undocumented as to both date of impact
> and in The vast majority of cases, not reliably recorded as to specific
> location of find. While these statements may (or may not) have
> credibility, my personal Value system being applied is, relatively
> speaking, irrelevant.
>
> 7) Mike Gilmer asked why some falls were hardly ever referred to as
> "hammers" though they fit the description: Holbrook, Allende, etc. Yes,
> Mike, in those cases the fall, itself was so extensive and significant in
> Other ways that, though they included in any reasonable hammer collection,
> That is not their only claim to fame.
>
>
> 8) What percentage of meteorite collectors specifically collect hammers?
> This would be an excellent polling question for the list. If people want
> to Email me off list, I will count up the responses and report to the
> list. I believe the list currently has about 900 members (it is impossible
> to know Because a significant number of people use more than one email
> address To receive posts). Regardless, we could get some idea. From
> conversations I have had with collectors, my GUESS would be about 10
> percent of all Collectors go out of their way to collect hammers (usually
> as ONE of their Interests in meteorites). However, a pole would be far
> more revealing, as Hammer collectors tend to contact me at a much higher
> rate than other Dealers, I am sure. When I opened my "Hammer Page"
> http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/Hammers.html
> I started with about 28 offerings of different falls. I now have over 40,
> I
> Belive. Both figures far surpass any other source I have been able to find
> Many times over.
> So, if people email me, I will report to the list. Here is how: Put
> ONLY "Hammer Collector" in the subject box (you don't even have to say
> Anything in the body of the text if you don't want to). Please DO NOT
> Include "Meteorite List" in the subject line - some days I get over 300
> Emails in one day - guess which ones don't always get checked out?
> (anyone who would get a specimen SPECIFICALLY Because of its status
> as a hammer) - Neither the size of your hammer collection nor the size of
> the specimens matter - just, do you collect them.
>
> 9) I will report back to the list the number of people who said they
> Collect
> hammers.
>
> 10) HAMMERS RULE!
>
>
> Best wishes, Michael
>
>
>
> on 1/3/09 11:59 PM, MeteorHntr at aol.com at MeteorHntr at aol.com wrote:
>
>> Hello Robert,
>>
>>
>> To answer your direct question, no I have not seen the "Hodges's
>> stone."
>>
>> However, in Dr. King's Meteorite Collection Catalog he listed the
>> source of his Sylacaga specimen as, and I quote:
>>
>> "Source: Alabama Mus. Nat. Hist., Douglas Jones"
>>
>>
>> Now, if anyone on the list has access to the Hodges's stone to
>> examine, my hunch is that the core would have been removed from the
>> bottom portion, as it is displayed, and the hole was probably plugged
> with something and colored so
>> as to hide the fact that a core was removed. My memory is a bit
>> fuzzy,
> but
>> as I recall there were some correspondence letters between Dr. King and
>> the Alabama Museum of Natural History at the time leading up to the
> acquisition.
>> And there was a concern that any examination would not hurt the
>> aesthetic appearance of the stone.
>>
>> However, it might be easier to ask the Smithsonian if their records
>>
> indicate
>> that any of their Sylacaga was traded to Dr. King. But with the
> conflict
>> NASA (including Dr. King) had with the Smithsonian in the 1960's I
>> seriously doubt any trades were done with the Smithsonian.
>>
>> As many of you know, we auctioned off the King Collection, and it
>> would make some of you sick if you knew how cheaply that specimen sold
>> for. I was surprised at the time, but then again, there were many great
>> specimens in the collection being sold, and most people had to
> budget where they spent their
>> money, so some things went a little lower than expected at that time.
> Since
>
>> then, the value has appreciated to more reasonable levels.
>>
>> I hope this answers your question Robert?
>>
>>
>> Steve Arnold #1
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> In a message dated 1/3/2009 10:11:11 P.M. Central Standard Time,
>> meteoritefinder at yahoo.com writes: Steve and List,
>>
>>
>> Steve, are you absolutely sure the core came from THE Hodges's stone
>> (
>> the one that struck her) and NOT the McKinney stone??? I have not
>> actually seen the Hodge's stone in person, and maybe you have, so you
>> MAY be right. But ... if I may quote a few words from "one of our
>> illustrious members'" ( who I hope doesn't mind me using them, and that
>> he will join in the discussion, too ) website that state:
>>
>>
>> "....There were two stones - the one that hit the human and one
>> other. The one that hit the human is the centerpiece in a local museum.
>> No one has ever had access to it. However,the second stone is
>> in the Smithsonion and though the remainder has never been available to
>> the public, it did have one core drilled in it. This core ended up in
> the collection of Dr.
>> King. After his death his widow allowed it to be cut into about 10
>> whafer slices all of which all ended up as primary specimens in private
>> collections."
>>
>> So have you seen THE Hodges' stone in person and saw that there
>> actually IS a hole drilled into THAT very one????
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Robert Woolard
>>
>>
>> **************New year...new news. Be the first to know what is
>> making headlines. (http://www.aol.com/?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000026)
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>
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Received on Sun 04 Jan 2009 12:35:50 PM PST