[meteorite-list] A New Question

From: mexicodoug at aim.com <mexicodoug_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue, 13 May 2008 18:53:37 -0400
Message-ID: <8CA83634F01E956-BC0-1050_at_FWM-M09.sysops.aol.com>

"Does anyone know What is the reasoning behind the ban?"

Hi David,

There is no "ban". Interested collectors from many nations have been
obviously stocking up collections for years with Antarctic meteorites.

Anyone (including commercial tour operators) can put together a
scientific plan for collecting Antarctic meteorites - at your co$$$t-
and apply for a permit. You cannot b denied the permit in your
jurisdiction as long as you can make convincing guarantees as judged by
administrators that you can provide at your cost, the required
scientific care in collecting, curating and furnishing the meteorites
basically free, to bonafide researchers for scientific studies, with
the caveat that if any time during the perpetuity that follows you can
no longer do this, you must transfer everything to an entity that
properly can.

The reason is simple, the Antarctic is a scientific preserve where the
natural resources are protected, like, say, the Old Faithful Geyser in
Yellowstone Park. If someone decided to drill out and cap the geyser
and pipe out the hot water for commercial use, how would that play on
your sense of morality? I think it would bother me... The scientific
preserve creation is a lucky windfall for environmentalists. The real
motivation behind this government collaboration is the worry that
brazen nations (and there is never a shortage of these) might abuse
this "no-man's land" while other "well behaved nations" stood by and
got jealous, disadvantaged, or had their security threatened. So the
countries agreed that military, disposal or commercial (i.e., mining,
harvesting flora or fauna) acivities by any treaty signatories was
mutually prohibited.

This is the "ban" you mention, no commercial meteorite hunters may
apply unless they plan on shouldering all the trip and collection
expenses by themselves and then giving away the meteorites to qualified
scientific interests only under the perpetually self-financed curating
scheme already mentioned. If this non-commercial ban were not in
effect, anyone could go to this frozen paradise and dump toxic wastes,
drill for oil and leave their holes uncovered, tear down the mountains
to make cement, colonize the place ignoring the unclear set of prior
claims of souvreinty (which others put on hold with promises that no
one else could ever jump their claim) and put explosive mines and guns
pointed everywhere (like big boy nations do anyway with their floating
and flying fleets on our polluted deep oceans). So politicians sided
with Greenpeace once this past millenia and decided that making it a
place to observe but not disturb was the only way to go.

Today, Antarctica is a pristine, white, wonderland, teaming with a
unique spectrum of life, a veritable fantasyland but for real, a
fragile window into an environment that is just as much Earth as the
Amazon jungle - which very few will every have the opportunity to
admire in person, unless they seriously take up a career in the
sciences and make contributions to society from studues there. It is
not a live battlefield subject where children are forced to work the
mines for $0.25 per day without medical care for all the fingers and
toes lost to frostbite, just so we can buy disposible containers with
Coca Cola's lithographed logotype.

I don't know, but I would think it is not impossible to get meteorites
 from permitted curating institutions in trades for special material
with perfect provenance traced back to its orientation on the ice.
However, good luck trading as I don't think anyone wants to have to
justify to administrators who always manage to attack with hindsight -
why they made a dumb trade of material that has been cataloged and
never unfrozen, and acts as a control as well as a variable, since the
day it was found. Had Tagish Lake happened in Alaska and collecting
been done like a space mission by private individuals, we could put the
concept to a real test.

Put another way, the parties realized there is no such thing as putting
it half-way in and not making other suitors jealous.

Best wishes
Doug
P.S. This is the only place I know where governments consider costs to
be incremental costs (and don't even give you credit for your meteorite
scale cube or double baggies). Everywhere else governments seem to
have a concept of cost that includes all the fat that they produce.
Ah...human governance...

PPS The Antarctic is but a coming attraction of what is to come in
Space... Probably it will be immoral to mine an asteroid in the
"Federation National Parks of the Asteroid Belt" at some point ...


-----Original Message-----
From: David & Kitt Deyarmin <bobadebt at ec.rr.com>
To: meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
Sent: Tue, 13 May 2008 5:04 pm
Subject: [meteorite-list] A New Question


Does anyone know What is the reasoning behind the ban??
?
-------------------------------------------------------------------?
?
A specific pre-treaty date is unclear. Some of the material that was
released into the market and that are considered 'pre-treaty': ?
Adelie Land ALHA 76001 ALHA 76003 ALHA 76005 ALHA 76006 ALHA 76008 ALHA
76009 Mount Baldr Thiel Mtns Lazarev Derrick Peak 78008 Neptune
Mountains ?
Most are next to impossible to get with the exception of ALHA 76009,
which is readily available. Thiel Mountains is out there, but expect to
pay $300-400/g for it. Lazarev was a Rob Elliot exclusive and will
probably never be available again unless a collector sells their own. ?
A tidbit of info is here: ?
http://astro-artifacts.com/Astroartifacts/AA_Antarctic_Meteorites.html ?
Kind regards, ? Mike Bandli www.Astro-Artifacts.com ?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
?
-----Original Message----- From: meteorite-list-bounces at
meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-bounces at
meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Pete Shugar Sent: Monday, May 12,
2008 7:52 PM To: Meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com Subject:
[meteorite-list] A New Question ?
When was the treaty banning the release of meteorites from Antarctica
to collectors placed into effect? How many meteorites excaped before
the ban? What are their names? Thanks in advance, Pete
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Received on Tue 13 May 2008 06:53:37 PM PDT