[meteorite-list] Fwd: getting oriented on orientation

From: MeteorHntr at aol.com <MeteorHntr_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 16:43:14 EST
Message-ID: <d0c.29ba2187.35006df2_at_aol.com>

Darryl and All,

I think we all are frustrated when a rounded rocks (or even chunky not even
crusted fragments) are called "oriented." It wastes time as we look for why
in the world it would be called "oriented" and it makes us wonder "If they
will lie about that, what else are they lying about?"
 
Maybe the solution is a list very similar to the one you gave, posted at the
IMCA website explaining what "Oriented" means, and how to self-diagnose an
oriented meteorite. A statement that all IMCA members agree to "accurately
describe" their meteorites could be given that page, and as such are obligated
to qualify any specimen as being oriented according to the guidelines set
forth.
 
A simple asterisk* in a description, could lead the reader to a note at the
bottom of the description to go to the IMCA website for further elaboration on
 the explanation of what "Oriented" means. That way paragraphs don't have
to be wasted on explaining everything, every time. Of course if one wanted
to explain everything, it would be fine, and in some case worth the effort
when selling a valuable specimen.
 
I think if everyone started referencing a certain stated list of qualifiers,
then it would be far harder for charlatans to slide in and take advantage of
people. It would be very hard for a person to reference the listed
characteristics of an oriented meteorite, then at the same time sell a rock that does
not meet ANY of those he just referenced.
 
Doing field work I run into people all the time, who have found a rock that
does not attract a magnet, that automatically think that qualifies the rock to
 be an "even more valuable achondrite, probably a moon rock." So, they got
the info SOMEWHERE that ~95% of meteorites will attract a magnet, but 5%
won't.
 
Having a posting, somewhere, I suggest the IMCA website, that defines what
an oriented meteorite is, will probably take care of most of our problems.
 
Then it still leaves it up to the individual to evaluate if a particular
specimen is oriented or not, and if so, to what degree.
 
In reality, there are so many other factors that contribute to the bottom
line value of a meteorite, not just if it is oriented or not. Some of those
are:
 
Type of meteorite
Size of the meteorite
TKW of the fall
aesthetics of the specimen
condition
    weathering
    broken pieces
    % of crust
etc.
 
How a particular person will value the various above factors will strongly
effect the value of a particular rock.
 
If sellers and buyers alike, have a place to reference what are
characteristics of an oriented meteorite, I think that is the best we can do. Trying to
subjectively grade a meteorite is going to be hard.
 
Then if anyone goes against those standards, then we can call them on it.
 
Now, does anyone want to build a list of how to grade a crater???
 
Then we can move on to making a scale of how "Rare" a certain meteorite is!
 
Steve Arnold
Arkansas
 
 
 

In a message dated 3/5/2008 3:14:56 P.M. Central Standard Time,
darryl at dof3.com writes:
as previously mentioned, some of the guidelines used to establish
orientation should be weighted more heavily than others.

when a stone is weathered, the only way to determine a high degree of
orientation would still be the reliance on the same conventions to
determine the extent of orientation.

for example....a highly weathered meteorite's morphology exhibits an
unmistakably curved parabolic surface, e.g., brenham main mass. of
course that should trump everything---the object is inarguably highly
oriented.

bottom line, if you can't discern for certain whether the specimen is
oriented per agreed upon guidelines, then you can't state the object
is oriented. it's that simple. ('tis frustrating to me when folks
mention that willamette is oriented. could have been. but it's
unverifiable. so it's not.)

in effect, what is implied with orientation is that if all of the
characteristics which denote orientation are weathered away, no
determination of orientation can or should be made on the most highly
weathered material. right?

all best / darryl
 



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Received on Wed 05 Mar 2008 04:43:14 PM PST