[meteorite-list] Re : Alternative Meteorite Group Track Records

From: Michael Gilmer <michael_w_gilmer_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 10:29:59 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <66263.60042.qm_at_web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

Hi Elton,

You said :

"In the words of a frequent poster "it is a free
> county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the
> groups or forums they wish--the Internet is a very large
> place. Those that offer a truly unique and desirable
> service will last and those that are offering another way to
> slice up the limited pie won't-- and will end up on the
> ash pile
> of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that
> did succeed, did so by offering real value and in an
> unselfish manner within many many manhours and personal
> expense to do so.
> "

I agree with this statement 100%. And I do not want this idea to
become another noble but doomed meteorite endeavor. That's why at
this point it's only an idea being discussed - we are trying to sort
out what exactly is missing from the extant meteorite groups,
and what the defunct groups did wrong. We want to avoid competition
and redundancy. So it's entirely possible that nothing will come
from this discussion - it might just be a brainstorming session.
It is my hope that something positive and useful will come from this.
If not, then I see no harm in having explored the possibilities.

Elton, feel free to join Yahoo list and share your insights there.
All points of view are welcome - especially those with veteran
experience in the area.

Best regards and clear skies,

MikeG

.........................................................
Michael Gilmer (Louisiana, USA)
Member of the Meteoritical Society.
Member of the Bayou Region Stargazers Network.
Websites - http://www.galactic-stone.com and http://www.glassthrower.com
MySpace - http://www.myspace.com/fine_meteorites_4_sale
..........................................................

>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Thu, 25 Dec 2008 23:47:31 -0800 (PST)
> From: Mr EMan <mstreman53 at yahoo.com>
> Subject: [meteorite-list] Alternative Meteorite Group
> Track Records
> To: valparint at aol.com, meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com
> Message-ID:
> <127207.70104.qm at web55201.mail.re4.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Hello Folks-- Season's greetings. I just wanted to
> share some thoughts on forming new meteorite interest
> groups--past empire building in the meteorite world in
> general and why some succeeded and some failed. Please, no
> one take this as an attack, trolling,disparagement,
> discouragement, or a "dissing" of anyone. It is
> not directed at any one, although it may have been bumped to
> the forefront by Mike's recent thread. An honest idea
> was proposed and I am not per se addressing his proposal in
> any way so please keep an open mind. On this list we are
> as close as can be to inclusive(99%) in having a collection
> of members within the existing meteorite interest niches.
> As a long time member with observations regarding
> "empire building" as an alternative to the
> Meteorite Central list, The Meteorite Times web space, IMCA,
> etc. there have been a plenty. I could list a long string
> of people who wanted to make a big splash campaigning to
> improve/perfect the
> culture they did not remotely understand. In spite of --
> or because of--self caused blunders, there were many patient
> old timers willing to advise them on how to get oriented to
> the list rather than making the list fit around them. They
> tried to help them get up to speed and direction with the
> technical side, the meteorite market, and the meteorite
> culture often being rebuffed, accused of trying to squash
> competition, or rejected as not knowing what they were
> talking about. What was hard for some novices to accept
> was that their own mindset was the reason they were unable
> to make inroads into the community as a true mover/shaker.
> There were many more that took the help and are strong
> respected contributors today.
>
> Not wanting to get in their way, the long-time members
> stepped aside, letting them fall into craters of their own
> making--some many times over. Many, many, times we have
> seen Internet/ web page savvy folks offer to provide
> "alternatives
> " to the meteorite forum communities. For the
> majority of those past forums, I'd have to look hard to
> see if they were still around. Some were more noble than
> others. There were some who spend a lot of effort making
> dust clouds promoting a solution looking for a problem.
> When the dust settled they sat wondering what went wrong and
> why their enterprise/forum/ efforts failed to hold
> attention.
>
> Just in passing, there are several meteorite interest
> groups/ mailing lists: some active but with only duplicate
> postings, some are inactive/abandoned with only newbie
> postings who never bothered to look at the membership
> numbers or posting activity, some private technical lists
> which are by invitation only, and of course-- the
> dealer's own list where ads go directly to the member.
> For reasons beyond the scope of this babbling of mine, 99%
> of all the inhabitable niches for this hobby have been taken
> and are being served well by the host. There is a saturation
> point and economy-of-scale even in this field of interest.
> In the words of a frequent poster "it is a free
> county" so anyone coould feel free to start up all the
> groups or forums they wish--the Internet is a very large
> place. Those that offer a truly unique and desirable
> service will last and those that are offering another way to
> slice up the limited pie won't-- and will end up on the
> ash pile
> of Internet redundancy entirely on their own. Those that
> did succeed, did so by offering real value and in an
> unselfish manner within many many manhours and personal
> expense to do so.
>
> What I found is that people who take shortcuts don't
> succeed: those who rely too much on assumptions, those that
> don't take a thoughtful look at the true market for
> their service, those that overestimate their expertise and
> time committment, those that don't attempt a basic
> understanding of the meteorite science to understand the
> commodity. Basically those who arrive thinking their
> personal marketing talents will overcome technical,
> knowledge, and cultural issues-- don't last over the
> long haul. Perhaps potential members are jaded by all the
> flash-in-the night sky "dealers" so they come to
> accept those proven members only after a long time of
> watching how they behave. I don't know of any shortcut
> to this period of watching and slowly winning people over.
>
> This community isn't a automobile dealership, it
> isn't a church, it isn't the Elks, it isn't a
> group of folks with a lot of mandated loyalty--it is a field
> where you are known by your reputation--reputation means
> everything to the majority of people. You can't forge
> (as in fake ) those credentials ; you have to forge them (as
> in earn them) by hard work over time. That seems to be the
> final obstacle to work through by those offering an
> alternative folks are willing sign up for. I've
> probably been ignored, filtered, and moderated over the
> years more than 99% of the folks here so I I feel like I
> know much of the list from both sides. I do wish any and
> everyone who is willing to go it for the long haul the best
> of success. If you promote it for the love of meteorites
> instead the love of self then you'll have a better shot
> at long term success.
>
> Elton
>
>


      
Received on Fri 26 Dec 2008 01:29:59 PM PST