[meteorite-list] Carnacas smoke-trail photos

From: Jeff Grossman <jgrossman_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Wed, 03 Oct 2007 06:13:54 -0400
Message-ID: <OFD811AC71.5F3C5C4F-ON85257369.00384D2C_at_usgs.gov>

There is no such naming convention.

Jeff

At 01:03 AM 10/3/2007, Sterling K. Webb wrote:
>The name of the village closest to the
>crater site is CARANCAS, not Carnacas.
>Under the naming convention, the nearest
>named human settlement would end up
>as the name of the meteorite when all the
>dust settles, no?
>
>Let's all practice: CA - RAN - CAS.
>
>
>Sterling K. Webb
>-------------------------------------------------
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Michael L Blood" <mlblood at cox.net>
>To: "Michael Farmer" <meteoriteguy at yahoo.com>; "Chris Peterson"
><clp at alumni.caltech.edu>; "Meteorite List"
><meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
>Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 11:33 PM
>Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Carnacas smoke-trail photos
>
>
>Perhaps I am dumber than a bag of hammers, but
>I am confused.... Are Carnacas and Titicaca two separate falls
>Or one in the same? Is anyone else confused on this issue?
> Michael
>
>on 10/2/07 5:59 PM, Michael Farmer at meteoriteguy at yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > Chris, it is a hell of a crater, at least 13 meters in
> > diameter, more than one meter of uplift, looks
> > identical to Meteor Crater to me, on a much smaller
> > scale.
> > There in fact does seem to be shocked material at the
> > crater, I found only inside and just outside the
> > crater, large pieces of compacted sandstone, yet there
> > is no sandstone there, it seems to have solidified on
> > the impact, everything else is more like soft mud.
> > Large, and I mean larger pieces of sod, weighing at
> > least 40 or 50 kilograms were thrown more than 50-100
> > meters, and smaller dirt clod debris thrown up to 15o
> > meters in all directions. This is a serious impact, I
> > mean you can call it what you want, but with the
> > uplift, the incredible debris field thrown to all
> > sides, the huge size, and volume of the crater itself,
> > certainly leads me to believe that the mass weighed
> > many tons and is obviously in the hole under some
> > meters of fallback debris. The locals report mushroom
> > cloud lingered for more than a hour.
> > As far as more pieces, this meterite came in over lake
> > Titikaka, and if you have never seen this lake, it is
> > HUGE! I would guess that as fragil as the meteorite
> > is, that tons of debris fell off but would most likely
> > have all fallen into the lake, or perhaps some on the
> > mountains just inside of Bolivia. It is not populated
> > there, and I assume from talking to most witnesses,
> > that the large main mass, which was a massive ball of
> > fire much larger and brighter than the Sun, caught
> > everyones attention pretty well, and would be so
> > bright that smaller pieces would be drowned out by the
> > intensity of the main mass. That is what I think
> > happened, surely many more pieces broke off but from
> > where the main mass hit, back down the flightpath is
> > nothing but swamps and high mountains for about 10
> > miles, then 15 miles of lake. Perfect for most
> > material to be lost.
> > Michael Farmer
> > --- Chris Peterson <clp at alumni.caltech.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> What remains to be determined is if this is actually
> >> a crater, or just a
> >> big splash. In the first case, some shocked material
> >> should show up, and
> >> I think it's likely that nothing is left in the
> >> bottom. If there really
> >> is a big meteorite at the bottom, then this probably
> >> isn't a crater in
> >> the usual sense (that is, produced by a large energy
> >> release as the
> >> parent body explodes/vaporizes).
> >>
> >> I don't believe I've seen anything credible to
> >> suggest that the water
> >> was actually boiling or steaming. It doesn't take
> >> much energy to make a
> >> hole this size in soft ground- probably around 100
> >> kg TNT equivalent.
> >> And that's not enough to heat up that much water
> >> very much. So I expect
> >> that any apparent bubbling was nothing more than an
> >> effect of ground
> >> water filling in the new hole.
> >>
> >> If the recovered material is shocked fragments, it
> >> may be structurally
> >> quite different from the parent body.
> >>
> >> Chris
> >>
> >> *****************************************
> >> Chris L Peterson
> >> Cloudbait Observatory
> >> http://www.cloudbait.com
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Darren Garrison" <cynapse at charter.net>
> >> To: <meteorite-list at meteoritecentral.com>
> >> Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2007 5:37 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Carnacas smoke-trail
> >> photos
> >>
> >>
> >>> On Tue, 2 Oct 2007 15:54:57 -0700 (PDT), you
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Is it indeed possible that a mass of say 3-7 tons
> >>>> could cause such intense heat on impact? We think
> >> that
> >>>> the compression of the soil, in an instant to many
> >>>> meteors deep could also cause intense heating.
> >>>> Every person we interviewed decribed boiling
> >> water,
> >>>> lots of steam, and horrible sulfer type smell. The
> >>>
> >>> What I wonder is if maybe the pressure/heat could
> >> have caused
> >>> dissolved gases to
> >>> bubble out from the water? So it might not have
> >> been at a boiling
> >>> temperature,
> >>> but still bubbling/steaming? Too bad we don't
> >> have samples of the
> >>> groundwater
> >>> and soil from the area to see if there is anything
> >> weird/extensively
> >>> poluted
> >>> about it.
> >>>
> >>> Also odd, of course, is a fraglie, porus stone as
> >> you describe
> >>> surviving to the
> >>> ground big enough and fast enough to make the
> >> crater.
> >>
> >> ______________________________________________
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> >>
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> >>
> >
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>
>--
>"God doesn't look at how much we do, but with how
>much love we do it."
> Mother Teresa
>--
>When Jesus said, "Love your enemies" I think he
>probably meant don't kill them.
>
>
>
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Dr. Jeffrey N. Grossman phone: (703) 648-6184
US Geological Survey fax: (703) 648-6383
954 National Center
Reston, VA 20192, USA
Received on Wed 03 Oct 2007 06:13:54 AM PDT