AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause clouding of consciousness
From: Stefan Brandes <brandes_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue May 9 12:06:40 2006 Message-ID: <005401c67382$89a7dc20$f49a2fd5_at_FORCEMACHINE> Right Ingo, Martin, we?re in Met-heaven today. Let?s see how long it lasts. And I?m afraid we?ll all see it, sooner than assumed. still a collector, Stefan > Well spoken, Martin! > > We all (collectors, dealers and scientists) should be happy to have the > possibility to get the rar material! > > Ingo > > > > > --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht --- >> Von: "Martin Altmann" <altmann_at_meteorite-martin.de> >> An: <Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com> >> Betreff: AW: [meteorite-list] insomnia can cause clouding of >> consciousness >> Datum: Tue, 9 May 2006 13:43:42 +0200 >> >> Dear list, >> >> we shouldn't loose in this discussions a more general sight. >> Dealers moan about the radical drop in prices, the difficulties to get >> the >> stuff classified, collectors bewail the lack of accurate data for their >> material, both groups permanently are afraid to experience a financial >> loss, >> scientists complain about a criminal plundering and feel to classify an >> ordinary chondrite is an emetic job; collectors and scientists accuse the >> dealers of being driven solely by rampant mammonism; collectors blame >> scientists and dealers to destroy fine specimens by cutting, dealers and >> collectors object to scientists to have an insufficient description >> system >> and no interest in bringing paired stuff together... >> >> If you read the list, then you inevitably get to the point, >> that the Sahara-boom must have been a downright terrible calamity!!! >> >> Well, I really don't know anymore, whether I have to make clear, that the >> short period of the desert rush, was and will be for all groups an >> incredible and, sadly, an irrecoverable enormous MEGA-TERA-PARA-BONANZA >> in >> all fields (hunting, collecting, sience, monetary aspects). >> >> Bernd, Joern, Dieter, Blaine, Alex - please you veterans help me to >> enlighten all those groups, that nowadays we are living in a meteoritical >> paradise !!! >> Tell them, how it was in the years before the desert rush. >> Tell them, how few different meteorites one could permanently acquire at >> all. >> Tell them, what an overwhelming sensation it was, to find exhibited on a >> dealers table a piece of a HOW or URE, which was larger sized than a >> fingernail! >> Tell them, what for a deep satisfaction it was, to get a pinhead sized >> bogey >> of something so exotic lice an ACAP or even a Moon in one's collection. >> Tell them, how catastrophically ruinous your fervor was, what efforts >> were >> to undertake to get a Brahin or a Sikhote into the colln. >> Good heavens folks, those weren't mythical ages aeons ago, that happened >> still 6-10 years ago! >> >> You Morocco-crusaders, tell them, how short those Sahara-boom lasted, >> tell >> them about the culmination 3 years ago, tell them how rapidly it is going >> to >> an end since. >> >> Scientists, tell them of those days, when it was an exiting event to get >> an >> eucrite on the table, tell them how appetently you were buying and >> trading >> the first desert finds! >> >> I really can't grok the permanent discussions here. >> What do we all want more???? >> >> On the one hand the permanent whining, that "market" is in ruin, on the >> other hand the whining about exaggerated prices, are you all blind? >> >> Collectors, the prices of today for desert material are 10-50 times LOWER >> than only a few years ago. What does it matter at this level, whether a >> DIO >> or a R has 200grams tkw or with its possible pairings 5kgs??? >> What shall those grieved faces, if you have bought a cumul EUC at 6$/g >> and >> some months later for a short period it is going for 2.5$/g ??? >> Do you seriously think, that in the very next few years prices will stay >> so >> low and that each type will still be disposable at will?? >> >> Dealers, what shall the anxiety that there is almost no profit to make at >> present times with desert and that you had losses with material bought a >> while ago? Sell meanwhile classical locations, they are stable and there >> you >> can earn money. And with desert: Don't you see, how the first type >> already >> tripled in price on ebay? Don't you see, that the supply from desert >> breaks >> down? >> Don't you see your collegues haply buying each brown boring stone they >> can >> get down there, for later folding their feet on the table in front of the >> fireplace in their villas? >> (Arrrrrgh any wealthy sponsor out there, for whom we could organize a >> mighty >> additional old age pension, as long as it is still possible?) >> >> And what about those plaints about the missing data for NWAs? >> The stuff is incredible dirt cheap and everyone knows, that there's the >> rub, >> in the way, they were collected, whereon nobody had any influence. >> Strewnfield data simply can't be retrieved anymore. Whether the pairings >> will be set together again, we will see much later, I personally guess, >> as >> it is already the case, at least the most rare types will be compared. >> If you can't bear to have such orphans in your collection, just don't >> acquire NWAs, take classical locations or Oman-meteorites (as long as >> it's >> still possible), who do have all data, but are paid like NWAs at present. >> Or buy from real Sahara-hunters, who record the data of their true finds, >> like e.g. Franco or the Berouds. >> >> Instantaneously the dilemma between accurate tkw of possible pairings and >> the official classification of stones, to calm the collectors to get 100% >> officially the right stuff, can't be solved. >> (A dilemma which can't be resolved, Martin Pleonasticus is speaking). >> And also the reproaches against the Met.Soc and the Nom.Com aren't >> justified. Please check the archive, wasn't it last year, when Grossman >> explicitely invited collectors and dealers here on the list, to help with >> their ideas to improve the nomenclature system for NWA-meteorites? >> As one of the results now all true finds with coordinates will get a >> proper >> name, to reward the finders, who cared for the record of data. >> And also with the classification issue I have to calm you, those >> unclassified NWAs sold, who says, that they would be lost forever? >> There is no obstacle, that they could be classified later. Look at the >> IMCA-site, there you find even an offer, where private collectors can get >> their stuff classified for free! >> >> We don't have to be purblind and just have to apply a perspective over a >> larger distance of time. >> The desert rush was an unique event in history of meteoritics. The mass >> of >> finds banged into a worldwide collector's scene of perhaps only 1000 >> people, >> that's the reason, why the prices dropped underground. It was a short >> period >> of only 4-5 years and there weren't unclear huge amounts of material >> found. >> Please reread the post, where Grossman extracted from the Bulletin >> database >> the total amount of recorded meteorites, wherefrom one easy can deduct, >> that >> with NWA all in all we speak only about very few tonnes. But because >> there >> are so few collectors on Earth, the prices felt, despite the fact, that >> meteorites are still the most rare matter on Earth. >> Additionally the tininess of that, what some of you call "meteorite >> market", >> explains, why only a single person, who is dumping a meteorite, is >> necessary >> for destroying the price for a while. As it happened in some cases. Take >> the >> actual Moon price for an example. Those fluctuations are transient. >> Take Mars. Still one year ago you could buy in ebay week by week nice 1g >> slices at 100-150$/g. Now you won't get any below 250-300$/g, even not >> 10g-slices. Remember Kainsaz. Do you think, you will find it at 2.5$/g >> again, like 2 years ago? When it's gone it's gone and the prices raise. >> See the always identical pattern with observed falls. If material appears >> for the first time, it is expensive. Soon, if it is a fall, where only a >> few >> different sellers get material, price will drop remarkably, after a >> while, >> depending how much material was set free, it becomes rare and the price >> raise again, often remarkably outreaching the initial price, at which the >> meteorite was sold for the first time. >> If smth is gone, it's gone. Read Michael Blood's column, where he's >> wondering, how expensive Gibeon is nowadays. No big wonder. Since the >> export >> prohibition only old material is still available. Gibeon is an excellent >> example, because in past it was by far the most common iron, smth like >> Campo&Sikhote today. On each fair the equation was valuable: Where >> meteorite, there Gibeon. Already in 2001, I remember, cause I wanted to >> buy >> some, suddenly on the Munich show, there were only perhaps a quarter of >> the >> amount of Gibeon, as the year before. The following 2 years, the dealers >> still had their old price tags, but now it wasn't DEM anymore, but they >> were >> in Euro (= doubled) and finally last year, there was a single half of a >> table, where still entire Gibeons were available, the price I didn't took >> in >> my notebook, because it was so expensive, that it was not interesting, >> and the Sprichs still had a single large specimen. >> (Btw. Andi and me still have some rough specimens for sale). >> Like this it will be with Sikhote-Alin, as it's over - already hard to >> find >> are meanwhile kg-pieces with regmaglypts >> And of course the same will happen with all NWA-material. >> Certainly it is difficult to estimate, how large the "overhang" of >> material >> still is and when the prices will react, but be sure prices will raise >> remarkably - sooner or later. >> >> And then don't complain, that Mr.Buckleboo hadn't warned you! >> Martin >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ______________________________________________ >> Meteorite-list mailing list >> Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com >> http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list >> > > -- > GMX Produkte empfehlen und ganz einfach Geld verdienen! > Satte Provisionen f?r GMX Partner: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/partner > ______________________________________________ > Meteorite-list mailing list > Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com > http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list > Received on Tue 09 May 2006 12:06:29 PM PDT |
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