[meteorite-list] Meteorite Pricing/Values

From: Greg Hupe <gmhupe_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Fri Dec 23 18:49:12 2005
Message-ID: <02d301c6081b$76908600$ae125c18_at_Gregor>

Hi Dean,

'Value", in my mind is a perception kind of thing. As I pointed out in my
earlier post, many factors dictate this. I started to read your post about
this but, unfortunately did not have time to read through it all. Bottom
line, there are far too many factors to say a certain meteorite (or coin
or...) is worth 'only' this amount or that. As in coins and stamps (and
fossils...), there are different grades and conditions that dictate values
for each "individual" piece. This is what I meant earlier.

Best regards,

Greg Hupe
The Hupe Collection
NaturesVault (eBay)
gmhupe_at_tampabay.rr.com
IMCA 2185

----- Original Message -----
From: "dean bessey" <deanbessey_at_yahoo.com>
To: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Friday, December 23, 2005 3:10 PM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Pricing/Values


>I dont think people will ever agree on a "value" for
> meteorites. I am a member of coin and stamp
> disscussion groups with excact catalog values and a
> big part of the postings to coin and stamp discussion
> groups are bickering over values. And those are
> products with known mintages, grading systems and
> other stable and predictable factors.
> The current (And unfortunate that should never have
> started) thread concerning Esquel makes a perfect
> example. $40 was always a "benchmark" value for esquel
> but ebay prices range from $10 to about $60 and I have
> seen faceted crystals offered in the jewellery trade
> for a couple thousand. Esquel is a meteorite where a
> single particularly nice crystal can affect the value
> of an otherwise identical piece. Its sort of silly to
> complain that somebody is overpricing esquel by $10 a
> gram.
> With my NWAs I can list 20 on ebay that are similar
> and some will sell for 10 cents and others for upwards
> of a dollar. But I often get less than some other
> dealers for them just because I flood the market with
> so many all at once (An often unconsidered factor that
> affects the value - the amount a dealer wants to sell
> fast). Dealers may need for money or a big collector
> wanting to upgrade makes a difference also.
> The overall size affects the value also (Smaller
> generally more per gram). For years in the stamp trade
> I made a lot of money buying blocks of stamps and
> breaking them up selling them as singles because you
> can walk into any stamp store and the quoted price for
> a block of 8 will only be say 4 or 5 times the price
> of a single (Or a block of 4 triple the single price).
> Check that out the next time you see a stamp shop.
> Same is true of meteorites where people dont want to
> spend $100 on every sample but would rather have four
> 1/5th size specimens at the same price.
> But what I am writing this email for is to comment
> about auctions. I hear time and time again (Including
> from my good friend Michael Blood who will provide
> what will probably be the cheapest way for a collector
> to acquire a meteorite during Tucson) that auctions
> set the price of something. If you consider ebay and
> the wide variations it has (Just look how cheap
> farmers Ureilite went for yesterday on ebay - you are
> not going to be able to duplicate that price every day
> for a ureilite). I sell meteorites that just a few
> days earlier a similar meteorite went for half or
> triple the price. Same is true about other things that
> I sell on ebay. So ebay has an auction certainly dont
> set the price of anything.
> But if they did meteorites would be unique as far as
> pricing went. Consider other collectibles. If you go
> to any stamp or coin auction - wither it be small city
> dealers, the swiss money fair auction or the Waldorf
> astoria auction in New York next month, you will
> notice something peculiar about the bidders. Even
> though anybody can attend the majority of people in
> attendance are dealers. Maybe 90% will be full time
> dealers. And the dealers will buy almost every lot. If
> you go to a christies art auction where people spend
> millions of dollars it will be almost all dealers. The
> Hong kong pearl auction will be attended almost
> exclusively by dealers. Michael Bloods meteorite
> auction has fewer dealers than almost any other
> auction you can attend (Because it is a getogether of
> people who only see each other occasionally in
> addition to simply an auction - Blood is providing a
> social setting in addition to an auction and many
> attendees will not buy anything) but dealers are the
> biggest byers (With a couple exceptions as they were
> will 5 or 6 deep pocketed collecters in attendance). I
> think I bought 17 lots the last time I attended Bloods
> auction.
> Think about it. Dealers dont attend auctions because
> they have to pay retail for their stock. Auctions are
> a great way to aquire something for the most part
> (That includes ebay in a lot of cases)
> Of course the scatter lot goes for big bucks as two or
> 3 bidders
> get out of hand and these lots always get the media
> attention - since auctioneers like telling everybody
> about the high realizations so that future people will
> consign more and to give them more prestige. But the
> dealers who are the auctions main buyers have dropped
> out long ago on lots that this happens to.
> There are to many factors to put a firm value on any
> meteorite. The fact that many are used for display
> purposes makes every meteorite a unique item that
> cant in any way be duplicated exactly and a buyer may
> find one extra thumbprint or shock vein or something
> else like a cute weathering spot that makes that one
> specimen somehow special and would make him pay mor
> for it rather than similar items. If another almost
> identical item went for 25% less a few minutes later
> it dont mean that the first buyer got ripped off.
> Meteorites has more vairables than most other
> collectibles and even with those other collectibles
> you cant put firm values on anything. Your local
> retail coin store in a mall will charge (And get) a
> lot more than coins will sell for at the waldorf
> astoria auction next month.
> But as with all the other discussion groups prices
> will always be a major topic of discussion with the
> met list. And should be as it gives people an idea of
> what the market is like (Even if it is usually
> slightly behind).
> In the coin industry you often hear that "There is a
> grade for buying and a grade for selling". And for
> esquel it is supposed to be $40 and if you are selling
> and it is supposed to be $15 if you are buying. But
> you can bet that every esquel transaction over the
> next year is not going to be exactly the same price
> that everybody on the met list says is the "correct"
> price (Even if matteo and farmer agreed on the correct
> "Not in ruin" price that big steve should sell his
> esquel at) - say $27.
> Bethany Sciences (While I hate bringing him up) offers
> (And gets) from his flashy catalog much higher prices
> than anybody (Including matteo on the few meteorites
> that are "Not in ruin" price wise) who sells on this
> list or on ebay. But no matter what anybody says about
> him Bethany does sell meteorites and the price is not
> in line with what anybody on this list will agree is
> within the accepted range of what a meteorite is
> "worth".
> So trying to nail down a certain value of any
> meteorite is lost at the end of the rainbow.
> But meteorites have fallen in value across the board
> by 90% because of the great NWA (Maybe I should say
> desert) rush. Affordable and attracting lots of new
> collectors. I think it is now a great time to be a
> meteorite collector as I personally believe that these
> current low prices will not last.
> Once prices start rising everybody will want in.
> I will draw one last parallel with another industry
> before I go. I herd a commodies dealer once (A friend
> from my stockbroker days) say that "at $280 nobody
> wants gold. If it went up to $600 tomorrow people
> would be beating down my door begging to pay $600".
> I wonder how meteorite collectors will reach once it
> becomes obvious that the desert has dried up and there
> will be shortages in the future.
> Cheers
> DEAN
>
>
>
>
>
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Received on Fri 23 Dec 2005 06:49:06 PM PST