[meteorite-list] Another fake name, serious business

From: Meteoryt.net <marcin_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue Nov 16 19:45:20 2004
Message-ID: <0af101c4cc3e$b27fdfe0$0300000a_at_polandme2iekcc>

Hello list.
I will try to answer to every questions that Mike is asking here.


> Anyone out there got any opinions on this?
> Here is another example of false name given to unclassified meteorite.
> http://www.polandmet.com/_nwa1906.htm
> This is POLANDMET, who has a page selling NWA 1906, a Rumuruti.
>
> Now, here is my page, of NWA 1906, the only stone classified and given
this
> number:
> http://www.meteoriteguy.com/nwa1906.htm


Yes on photos they looks different. I newer see Your specimens in real, but
also I never know that NWA1906 is "Your" number. But this WHY i named is as
NWA1906 I will explain bottom.


>
> The problem, that is my meteorite, one stone, no pairings ever announced.
> Take a look at the two pages, the meteorites are not even similar in any
> way.
> Mine is NWA 1906, since I had it classified, Polandmet's does not even
come
> close to mine. It doesn't look the same, it has much larger chondrules,
> multicolored, and is just totally different. Not to mention that there are
> clearly two different meteorites on that same page. Note the slices at
top,
> very nice clear multicolored chondrules, then the slices are the bottom,
> smaller chondrules, more weathered, clearly brecciated.
> These meteorites are totally different.

Yes, specimen on top I buy first, second specimen was purchased later,
but.... both stones are THE SAME METEORITE.
I not delete photos from sold slices from first specimen to SHOW that every
slice, begin from endpiece have less " normall orange" matrix and more
perfect chondrules matrix, and finally last slices have only perfect
chondrules and no "orange" matrix. This is any kind of chondrite-rich
inclusion, just a special specimen. I hope photos explain everything.


> I am publicly demanding from Polandmet to answer this.

I publicly answering , but I not understand why You doing this publicly. If
I make a "crime" against "Your" numbers we should resolve this off-line,
becouse this is case beetween us. From my side results of my answer will be
the same as when this will be readed by 600 persons or only by you.

> What makes you think that you can sell a meteorite under the number that
my
> stone received? What makes you think they are paired? Why are you doing
> this?

I purchased this specimen in Morocco. I was there for the first time last
april.
I buy it from a well know Maroccan dealer AS NWA1906. Later in June I saw in
Ensisheim other persons selling THE SAME material as NWA1906 R4 and NWA2289
R3-6. Comparing photos is not the same as comparing material in real, slice
to slice under loupe. So I was sure that I have NWA1906 and NWA2289. So I
start selling this without any BAD intention to anyone. Just another
meteorite, as other that I buy in Morocco.

Im only astonished Mike, why u asking me about NWA1906 right now ? I not
sell on ebay this meteorite for more than month, where You should see it as
possible wrong named material ? Why u not sended this email in september
when I selling few slices per week, and announced it on this list many times
? Why this happend right now ?


> This has the potential to collapse the entire meteorite market.
> We are only as good as our name, and I have worked very hard to do things
> right. I would NEVER sell someone a meteorite that is not what it is
claimed
> to be.
> But this is what these dealers are doing, making visual pairings to keep
> from having to do their own work.
> Buyer beware, it seems that the only way to get official material is to
buy
> from the dealer who made the official classification.
> Michael Farmer
> Awaiting a response from Polandmet and Edwin Thompson.

Last word

Now we have a little different view for some things. I talking about all
this emails from Hupes Team about NWA1877 / NWA1110 not autorised sale. But
half year ago I must say that I not thinking much about this if my Rumuruti
is NWA1906 or not. I was sure that I sell right meteorite, the same as IM
SURE that I sell now Amgala as Amgala, NWA869 as NWA869, Gao-Guenie as
Gao-Guenie or Kilabo as Kilabo.
Becouse e.g. someone is "owner" of Gao-Guenie name so I should classify my
next shipment from Burkina Faso as Gao-Guenie (f) or Ouagadougou H5, becouse
I buy it from this city, not from Gao village. The same is with many other
meteorites. So why here NWA1906 can be exception ?

Who is "owner" of Amgala name ? Tell me please if I have right to use this
name for my specimens purchased in Morocco ? Ask Dean Bessey if his lot of
Amgalas comes from right source or maybe he just buy them on desert and his
WISH is that he have Amgala? All dealers who just buying for example
Ben-Sours or Taza in Morocco. Why they are "sure" that they have the
original material ? I think that my pairing, using my own eyes is not
exception. Many dealers, include You Mike, classify meteorites "on the fly"
using loupes or You just TRUST Your marocan friend. I just trusted person I
meet in Morocco. Now I see that I should be more carefull. But importand is
that my meteorites I buy in Morocco not on marketplace, but from well know
Marocan delaer, from who buy meteorites also other big USA dealers. So how I
should not trust him? With this "big NWA river" that comes from Morroco
there must be mistakes and errors.

Another problem is that for sure I dont have place for classifications. When
I asking This List noone help me with good results. So also if I want to
classify in April my new Rumuruti I dont have place to do this. Not so long
time ago I find by myself web page of NAU Laboratory where is offer of
clasification new meteorites. So my next purchases of unknown material from
Morocco for sure I send to classification. Ofcourse if NAU find time to take
my meteorites for classification. But this is ofcourse just my problem now.

At last:
Comparing now Your photos with all specimens of NWA1906 I saw on fairs or
internet and with all my specimens I must say that THIS IS NOT THE SAME
MATERIAL. I make mistake. But I not do this with Bad intention. I not named
my material as NWA1906 becouse this number was first I saw or becouse I
wanted make anything against You Mike. I can say only "Im sorry Mike".

I will right now stop selling this meteorite as NWA1906, and anyone who buy
this meteorite from me and are unhappy, can return specimens with full
refund.

PS, Material that was sell by me as NWA1906 was also classified as NWA2289
R3-6.
For compare NWA2289 R3-6 http://www.meteoriten.com/special.html
For me its the same meteorite and now this cant be another mistake, but
ofcourse I will not rename my rumuruti to another "good" number.



-----[ MARCIN CIMALA ]-----[ I.M.C.A.#3667 ]-----
http://www.Meteoryt.net marcin_at_meteoryt.net
http://www.PolandMET.com marcin_at_polandmet.com
http://www.Gao-Guenie.com GSM +48(607)535 195
--------[ Member of: Polish Meteoritical Society ]--------
Received on Tue 16 Nov 2004 07:45:12 PM PST