[meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?

From: Michael Farmer <meteoritehunter_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Tue Aug 24 13:47:41 2004
Message-ID: <00e601c48a02$7292af80$0200a8c0_at_S0031628003>

Norm, are you saying that you know that the pieces are all from Chaco then?
I don't know about the terrain, the closest I have ever been to Campo is
Uruguay.
I have no problem with that debate, again, not a problem to me whether there
are hills or no hills. I do know that the term "New Campo" was never
implying that they were anything other than campo, but you cant deny that
for 50 years, the only campos were ugly rustbuckets, and then when the "new
Campos" came up, they were gorgeous, regmaglypted, sometimes with fusion
crust, a 180 turn from the garbage before, so I think they should be
distinguished with some term, "new" seems ok to me.
    I was just in the Mundrabilla Strewnfield, where it stretches over 100
miles, and mush less of Mundrabilla is known than Campo, so obviously the
strewnfield is huge.
    When I am told the pieces are from Santiago del Estero and are legal,
what choice do I have but believe it? In court, without proof, then you cant
make charges that those pieces are stolen from Chaco. Are some? Likely, but
to charge that without proof is not right.
    Mike Farmer
----- Original Message -----
From: "Norman Lehrman" <nlehrman_at_nvbell.net>
To: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>; "Michael Farmer"
<meteoritehunter_at_comcast.net>
Cc: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 10:37 AM
Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?


> Adam, Mike, & everyone,
>
> This is a significant subject, partly in that there is
> a bunch of misinformation regarding new Campos on
> Ebay.
>
> I spent last winter in Chile and Argentina, and
> although I did not visit Campo del Cielo, I did spend
> time with the family on who's land the principal part
> of the strewn field is located.
>
> They affirm what Adam's respondents have reported:
> there is no "new" area on a mountain side. The "new
> Campos" are indeed simply from greater depth in the
> exact same area as the "old" Campos.
>
> There is a reason for the inaccurate claims to the
> contrary. The strewn field is mostly in the Chaco
> province which has enacted legislation making export
> illegal. However, the strewn field overlaps the
> province boundary into the adjacent Santiago del
> Estero Province which currently has no such law.
>
> As a result, to reduce chances of legal problems,
> exporters are claiming that their material comes from
> a "new" area in Santiago del Estero---essentially
> equivalent to saying "the fossils I am selling come
> from private land just outside the National Park
> boundary".
>
> Cheers,
> Norm
> (http://tektitesource.com)
>
>
> --- Adam Hupe <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net> wrote:
>
> > Hi Mike and List,
> >
> > I think it is very relevant information and more
> > importantly it concerns
> > meteorites. Mike, if you took the time to read I am
> > investigating new areas
> > to add to my travel itinerary. Others may be
> > interesting in going there and
> > should be concerned about things such as terrain and
> > the laws governing such
> > things.
> >
> > All the best,
> >
> > Adam
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Michael Farmer" <meteoritehunter_at_comcast.net>
> > To: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>;
> > <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 10:07 AM
> > Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth
> > Busted?
> >
> >
> > > Interesting, but what is the point? Are you making
> > a point? Why are you
> > > worried about Campo now?
> > > Any why post "emails" with no authors. If people
> > are not willing to post
> > > their names, regardless of the info, I think
> > anything they write is
> > > worthless.
> > > I dont really care, as I have been sold out of
> > Campos for years, but
> > still,
> > > this is an odd discussion you are making.
> > > Mike Farmer
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Adam Hupe" <raremeteorites_at_comcast.net>
> > > To: <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:52 AM
> > > Subject: [meteorite-list] New Campo -Myth Busted?
> > >
> > >
> > > > Dear List,
> > > >
> > > > I would like to thank those who responded to my
> > inquiry about old versus
> > > new
> > > > Campos. I am looking to explore new areas and
> > thought this locality
> > might
> > > > have been worth investigating but have since
> > changed my mind. Below are
> > a
> > > > set of responses that best address this issue.
> > The authors would like
> > to
> > > > remain anonymous so I left their names out.
> > > >
> > > > ***********************************************
> > > > Email #1
> > > >
> > > > Your "well informed source" is correct on both
> > counts. Illegal
> > exportation
> > > > and there are no mountainside finds. The terrain
> > is basically flat and
> > the
> > > > strewn field is shorter and wider than presented
> > in Cassiday's various
> > > > papers. The reports of a specimen recovery 70-80
> > km down-range are
> > > repeated,
> > > > but have never been evidenced. The difference
> > between 'new' and 'old'
> > > Campos
> > > > is the depth of recovery. Cassiday's specimens
> > recovered 1962-73 are
> > both
> > > > 'new' and 'old'. Recovered at depth within the
> > craters are 'new'; those
> > > > recovered from surface ejecta or from farmers'
> > fields are 'old'.
> > Repeated
> > > > irrigation and the use of fertilizers has taken
> > its toll. Cassiday used
> > a
> > > > WW2 metal detector in his search. With the
> > increasing demand by
> > > collectors -
> > > > beginning about 1989 - much more powerful
> > detectors are being used in
> > > > recovery; the deeper recoveries being more
> > stable. Not all of the 'new'
> > > > specimens are stable as some specimens continue
> > to be found at shallow
> > > > depths. The extremely flat surface of the region
> > is subject to sheet
> > > > deposition 1-2 cm/100 yr (think Kansas). Runoff
> > is limited to shallow
> > > > depressions and occasional shallow channels; the
> > slopes of which might
> > be
> > > > miss translated as mountain-sides.
> > > >
> > > > The pre-entry meteoroid is estimated to be ~ 3 m
> > in diameter and masses
> > ~
> > > > 840,000 kg (Lieberman, et al., in MAPS Feb 2002)
> > and suggests that many
> > > more
> > > > specimens will be smuggled out in the coming
> > years.
> > > >
> > > > Other than the variously published photos by
> > Cassidy et, al. I was only
> > > able
> > > > to locate photos of the "Haag" specimen. Its
> > recovery down-range is
> > > > consistent with aerial break-up scenarios and is
> > probably the Campo del
> > > > Cielo main mass.
> > > >
> > > >
> > ****************************************************
> > > > Another Note:
> > > >
> > > > The place where the "New Campos" are found is
> > the same that the one of
> > the
> > > > "Old Campos". The difference is the "old" are
> > near the surface, so them
> > > > intensely undergone the effects of the
> > meteorization, mainly the
> > humidity.
> > > > The "new" are deeper so that them could conserve
> > its regmagliptes and
> > have
> > > a
> > > > greater stability. The "New Campos" began to
> > appear when the zone was
> > > > released with powerful metal detectors.
> > Previously the espec?mentes were
> > > > found on the surface or raised when the fields
> > were plowed.
> > > > The Campo del Cielo strewn field has 45km by
> > 15km. But it has an area of
> > > > approximately 1500 hectares where the greater
> > concentration is verified.
> > > > Many authors affirm that the strewn field
> > reaches 80 km, because stories
> > > > exist on the denominated "Mes?n de Fierro",
> > probably situated 70 km to
> > the
> > > > NE of the main site. But until today it was not
> > verified.
> > > >
> >
> *******************************************************
> > > >
> > > > I hope you found this information to be as
> > interesting as I did,
> > > >
> > > > Adam
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ______________________________________________
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> > > >
> >
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> > >
> > >
> >
> >
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> >
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Received on Tue 24 Aug 2004 01:47:31 PM PDT