[meteorite-list] Dealer Refunds: IDENTITY and DOUBLE GAUL

From: Charlie Devine <moonrock25_at_meteoritecentral.com>
Date: Thu Apr 22 10:22:44 2004
Message-ID: <18975-3EFEC302-404_at_storefull-2357.public.lawson.webtv.net>

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Hello everyone,

On ebay I am shawomet, and I am the person whom Matteo is suggesting be
blackballed on ebay because I left him negative feedback.
I am very sorry that Matteo chose to air our differences on this list.
When he continued to lie to me, I told Matteo he was very lucky I was
keeping this between the 2 of us. Now he has decided to slam me in
public, so, to set the record straight, here is why Matteo is so upset
with me.

It begins with the simple fact that Park Forest was a very special fall
in my opinion. My emphasis in collecting has always been more on the
history, and less on the science. So, Park Forest had it all in my
eyes. I knew I was reading about, on this list, a fall that would rank
as very historic. I resolved that I would try to acquire as many
samples of the various hammers or "house smashers" as I could.
It's 3 months later and I believe I did well in reaching my specific
goals.

Then one day I saw this ebay auction just a few hours after Matteo
listed it:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2178091504

This listing gave the unmistakable impression that the seller was
offering a slice of the stone that hit the roof of the PF Firestation!
With a buy-now option of $55 for a 1g slice. I thought, "wow, what a
way to round out my PF hammer collection!". But I also thought "I
thought the PF town council had decided to sell this stone to a museum?"
I then did what I've never done before. Bid first ( or in this case
"buy-now" first ) and ask questions later. If this really were a piece
of the PF Firestation stone, the auction might end with a buy-now before
Matteo could answer my questions. So I ended the auction and
immediately wrote to Matteo. I told him I would send payment if he
could provide the evidence that this was indeed from the PF Firestation
hammer. His reply did not really address my question. He told me that
he got the slice from Michael Blood, who got it from the Hupes. He told
me he had a slice from this stone on his collection page. He did, and
it was captioned "Firestation stone".

I decided to contact Michael Blood, but he was not around. I decided to
sleep on it. Lo and behold, when I awake I remember that Michael did
offer pieces of a stone that had fallen across the street from the
firestation. Matteo was mistaken. It must be a piece of this stone
that I had purchased. So I wrote to Matteo and told him he must be in
error, but being an honorable man, I would pay his ebay fees since I had
bid first and asked questions later. A small loss for me, no loss for
Matteo.

Matteo's reply to my suggestion was that I could believe one of 2
things. I could believe that Michael Blood was a liar, or I could
believe the slice came from the stone that penetrated the roof of the
firestation. Whatever Matteo's reason for putting it that way, I "fell
for it" and sent my payment. A perfect example of being told what I
really wanted to hear and believing it I guess.

Several days went bye when I noticed a post from Michael to the list.
Seeing that he was around I contacted him and discovered my memory had
been correct. Michael never offered this hammer on his pre-post list
and Michael never told Matteo that the pieces Matteo bought from him
came from the Firestation impactor. Michael also fwd me a copy of his
old PF pre-post. I fwd this pre-post to Matteo and presented it as
evidence that the specimen I purchased, and which was now enroute to me,
was not what Matteo claimed it was. Matteo's reply was that perhaps the
description "fell across the steet" from the firestation had been lost
in his emails with Michael. Matteo did not offer, as I expected he
would, and as I would have immediately done myself, a refund or other
form of adjustment that would make up for his misrepresentation of this
auction listing.

When the item arrived, I left negative feedback.
That feedback simply stated the truth of the matter. I did not demand a
refund that I felt the seller should have offered me of his own free
will. I wrote it off as a gamble on my part, a gamble I had lost.

After I had posted the feedback, Matteo contacted me and reminded me
that he had told me if I did not believe the piece was from the stone
that hit the firestation, I did not have to send payment. He has
repeated this claim on this list. Matteo, as I told you yesterday, I do
not like being lied to. I told you that I have saved all your emails.
And I state catagorically:
at no time did you tell me not to send payment.
Rather, you told me that if it were not from the stone that hit the
station, then Blood was a liar.
Since I don't believe that Michael is a liar, and it didn't dawn on me
that you might be misleading me, you got paid and I own a pretty
expensive slice of "ordinary" PF.

In closing, I want to state, that I left Matteo negative feedback
because I felt I was lied to.
While the feedback was strongly worded, I'm not all bent out of shape
about what happened.
I accept responsibility for my "bid now, ask questions later" approach.
If Matteo had simply agreed to my offer to pay his ebay fees for the
item I purchased, there would be no negative feedback and I would'nt be
offering a long-winded expaination of a matter that Matteo should have
kept between the 2 of us. Again, I am sorry that this business is being
aired in public. I do hope this is the last word that anyone expects
from me on this matter.

Best wishes,
Charlie


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From: Michael L Blood <mlblood_at_cox.net>
To: Tom aka James Knudson <knudson911_at_frontiernet.net>, Ken O'Neill <kenoneill@kenoneill.com>,
        "Meteorite-List (E-mail)" <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>, M come Meteorite Meteorites <mcomemeteorite2000@yahoo.it>
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Subject: [meteorite-list] Dealer Refunds: IDENTITY and DOUBLE GAUL
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Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2003 17:32:57 -0700

Ken, Tom, Matteo & all,
         Let me put a bloody end to all this
 nonsense, right now.
         Matteo, if you hadn't had the GAUL to slam a good person
yesterday, as per below, I would have kept my bloody mouth
shut. I quote you as follows from yesterday's post to the list:
--
Hello all
I addvise all to stop this ID in your ebay spam list,
the person in matter buy from me a slice of PF that
came from the close pavement of the fire station in
park forest.  By mistake I had written that it came
from the roof of the station, but I said him that it
was able not to buy it and I I replaced it in sale.
The person instead buy the same the piece and put a
negative feedback to me, a behavior from idiotic
truth.  Block this person if do not want to have
surprised.  
ID: shawomet
--
         Now, as for this buyer whom you claim did you wrong:
This is a customer of mine, Matteo. He saw the same post
from me off of which you bought the Park Forrest (at $25/g,
which is $5/g more than you paid Steve Arnold - it is
OBVIOUS you are the person who wanted him to refund
your $ - anyone who has dealt with you recognizes the same
o same o with Steve and with John - clear as a bell)
         So, this customer contacts me and asks if I miswrote
in my ad that it fell ACCROSS THE STREET from the
Fire Station, or did it actually hit the fire station. I explained
it fell accross the street and that you had a hard time with
English and perhaps missworded your statement, AS I HAD
BEEN VERY CLEAR WITH YOU UPON PURCHASE ABOUT THIS
PARTICULAR SPECIMEN, as we exchanged emails until there
could be NO DOUBT in your mind.
         Now, Matteo, you are claiming a VERY different story
than this customer, who said in attempts to clarify with
you, you were emphatic about this stone hitting the fire
station. 
         Now you email the list bad mouthing him because he
filed a negative eBay feedback on you.....
         And you have the astonishingly poor taste to do this
while the whole list is up in arms about you mewling about
a deal with Steve Arnold (go ahead, I double dog dare you
to deny it is you) ABOUT MATERIAL FROM THE SAME FALL!!!
         I have long suspected your understanding is greater than
you let on.  I will no longer give you the benefit of the doubt.
Your credibility is ZERO with me.
         Like I said, I wouldn't even have commented on this
thread at all if you hadn't audaciously bad mouthed
"showamet" to this list yesterday. Just last week, I made up
a list of eBay names and anyone and everyone can look up
this is Charlie Devine.
    When I have something to say to people, I say it to their face,
but your public slander of this person's good name is absolutely
amazing and has pushed me over the edge.
        Sincerely, Michael L. Blood
         
 
 
> on 6/28/03 2:30 PM, Tom aka James Knudson at
> knudson911_at_frontiernet.net
> wrote:
> 
> > Hello List, Ken wrote;
> > "we still haven't heard both sides."
> > 
> > That is because there is not an "other side". The
> guy is wrong and has no
> > leg to stand on!
> > Thanks, Tom
> > The proudest member of the IMCA 6168
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Ken O'Neill <kenoneill_at_kenoneill.com>
> > To: Meteorite-List (E-mail)
> <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> > Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 2:26 PM
> > Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Dealer Refunds
> > 
> > 
> >> Hi All,
> >> 
> >> I was of the opinion tending towards a refund. I
> must now admit that in
> > this
> >> particular case this would not now be my
> decision.
> >> A dealer should really be "on the ball" with
> regards to pricing.
> >> Each case must be judged on it's merits, we still
> haven't heard both
> > sides.
> >> Has the other side any merit ?
> >> 
> >> A very interesting thread.
> >> 
> >> Regards
> >> 
> >> Ken O'Neill
> >> 
> >> 
> >> 
> >> ______________________________________________
> >> Meteorite-list mailing list
> >> Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
> >>
>
http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> >> 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ______________________________________________
> > Meteorite-list mailing list
> > Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
> >
>
http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
> 
>  
> 
on 6/28/03 2:30 PM, Tom aka James Knudson at knudson911_at_frontiernet.net
wrote:
> Hello List, Ken wrote;
> "we still haven't heard both sides."
> 
> That is because there is not an "other side". The guy is wrong and has no
> leg to stand on!
> Thanks, Tom
> The proudest member of the IMCA 6168
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Ken O'Neill <kenoneill_at_kenoneill.com>
> To: Meteorite-List (E-mail) <meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com>
> Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 2:26 PM
> Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] Dealer Refunds
> 
> 
>> Hi All,
>> 
>> I was of the opinion tending towards a refund. I must now admit that in
> this
>> particular case this would not now be my decision.
>> A dealer should really be "on the ball" with regards to pricing.
>> Each case must be judged on it's merits, we still haven't heard both
> sides.
>> Has the other side any merit ?
>> 
>> A very interesting thread.
>> 
>> Regards
>> 
>> Ken O'Neill
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ______________________________________________
>> Meteorite-list mailing list
>> Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
>> http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________
> Meteorite-list mailing list
> Meteorite-list_at_meteoritecentral.com
> http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
 
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